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Old 10-13-2011, 06:54 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,731,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanrene View Post
Greece is the economic model the Left is trying to emulate.
The fact that Greece is bankrupt doesn't say anything about their education system. Some countries with "free" higher education are doing fine, others not so. The reasons for Greece's economic problems are of a different kind.
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:56 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Short sighted. Yes, colleges have been dumbed down so that everyone with an IQ over 70 can get a college degree but that's not going to help anything in the long run. Employers are now finding out that college graduates they hire cannot read simple instructions, and they cannot perform basic math.

What's happening is that a college degree means less and less.

A truly motivated kid will get a job and work hard and pay for his tuition and college costs. And college isn't hard at all if you're really cut out for it, classroom time is 15-18 hours a week, you need 4-10 more hours to study, and that leaves plenty of time to work even a full time job.
Maybe that's the case in the US, in other countries attending university is so challenging you don't have time for a job, let alone a full-time job.
There are part-time courses, though, where one can go to work half the day, and study half the day. Basically you are stretching the full-time course over 8 years or so.
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:58 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,672,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
It's simply a different attitude:
In some countries higher education is treated the same way as kindergarten, secondary education, health or safety, i.e. something provided to everyone and paid for by everyone (not just those with more money as you say).
In other countries higher education is considered an optional luxury one has to pay for individually.
In the USA however we are offered plenty of options. Smart kids might get a job, live at home and commute to a community college for the first two years and even work for a scholarship that they didn't get when graduating from high school.

The option of living away on some campus for 4 years and no expectation of having to work any kind of job all that time is obviously a luxury - fine if you or your parents can afford it, but it's not the only option.

I know plenty of physicians and lawyers and high paid people who actually were not afraid to work a job while going to college and since they were smart enough, they didn't need 24-7 to study.
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:01 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,672,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Maybe that's the case in the US, in other countries attending university is so challenging you don't have time for a job, let alone a full-time job.
University or college is not all that difficult if you have the aptitude and IQ for it. Not just the IQ, but you can certainly work 20-30 hours and attend college. You might have to give up some of the partying however. In the USA 15-18 hours is considered taking a full load -- and that means only 3 or 4 hours a day in a classroom. A chemistry or physics lab might be 3 hours one or two days a week, but there is certainly time left over to work.
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:03 AM
 
855 posts, read 1,172,614 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
No such thing as free education.

Germany VAT is approaching 20%. Income tax caps at 45%. Property taxes are out of this world. Germany has one of the lowest home ownership rates of any industrialized nation. Multi-generaltional households are common.
i think this explains well the misunderstanding and disconnect many americans have about life overseas. our system has become such a cluster**** that many folks have become confused and deluded into believing that any other system will not work. nevermind the fact that what we have DOES NOT WORK.

maybe a VAT tax wouldn't be so bad. and property taxes should be higher, maybe it would prevent people who have no business owning a home from owning a home. home ownership is not a necessity in many parts of the world. it's only in america where people have been scammed into believing that spending ridiculous amounts on mortages to "own" something is a good idea.

on another note, maybe multi-generational households wouldn't be such a bad idea--that's how things were done back in the day. might reinforce family values instead of this every man for himself attitude that's taken over *shrugs*
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:03 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,731,689 times
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Why "afraid" to work? They will have to work for the rest of their lives anyway. And often these days graduates have to do unpaid internships after graduation, so they have side jobs after college.
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,275,532 times
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:07 AM
 
855 posts, read 1,172,614 times
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there's a lot of bitterness towards higher education on this thread...

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Old 10-13-2011, 07:09 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,275,532 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chariega View Post
there's a lot of bitterness towards "free" higher education on this thread...
Wanted to make sure you got your point across clearly.
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:11 AM
 
Location: South East
4,209 posts, read 3,588,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
It's simply a different attitude:
In some countries higher education is treated the same way as kindergarten, secondary education, health or safety, i.e. something provided to everyone and paid for by everyone (not just those with more money as you say).
In other countries higher education is considered an optional luxury one has to pay for individually.
Doesn't really matter about other countries. This is the United States and college education is not provided to everyone. This is not a socialistic society and never will be.....thank goodness!

Additionally, the US provides plenty of opportunity to those whom want to better their life - far more than most countries. However, one must work for that and not expect it to be handed to them to be fair just because someone else has it.

And therein lies the difference between the majority of the left and the majority of the right.
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