Rick Scott wants to shift university funding away from some degrees (ethic, health care)
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The idea introduced in the post I was responding to was that we should subsidize those most likely to be employed. Why stop at major? We can be even MORE efficient by subsidizing by racial group, minority group membership, etc., that are most likely to work... Seems to be a simple, logical extension.
No, the post you were responding to was mine, and I in no way suggested or implied what you are purporting. Race and/or minority membership has absolutely nothing to do with field of study, so stop with the race baiting.
I work in tech-- I've worked with plenty of smart, competent, and engaging liberal arts grads over the years and computer science majors that were complete zeros. An University is a place where human knowledge is advanced and people learn-- hopefully about a diversity of topics.
I think that's prob due to personality, not their college education, esp since gen ed classes are required for all degrees, a diversity of topics, as you say.
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If you want job training there are plenty of other avenues for that.
The end goal of college IS job training. It's not a 4 year lesson in personality skills and useless knowledge, at least it shouldn't be.
The end goal of college IS job training. It's not a 4 year lesson in personality skills and useless knowledge, at least it shouldn't be.
No. No. No. How much time have you spent at a University? The purpose of a University is to advance human knowledge. Scientific Inquiry.... Advancing the species...
Job and professional training is a secondary benefit and one that lags far behind general education. People are better off being educated, No? People are better off with knowledge on a wide variety of topic. Being a good manager is not just B-school classes, but a sense of problem solving, ethics, psychology, technical writing and communication, geography, etc. That doesn't come from simply taking Business Management 101.
A better educated society is a better society and that includes all fields.
If you want simple job training, ITT Tech and Butler Business School are fine. However, the type of jobs that I have had seek people who are well rounded and generally well educated. I use a myriad of skills to run my business every day -- and they didn't just come from my computer science classes.
I learned to solve problems and think critically. Those are skills they don't emphasize at ITT Tech and skills that any well educated person should be able to draw on in any field-- And that comes from the balance of liberal arts classes outside your field.
But universities and job training? No. A well educated person can adapt to almost any job quickly. Which is why you find top-tier English majors practicing medicine, running companies, at top levels of government as well as writing books and teaching high school English.
No, the post you were responding to was mine, and I in no way suggested or implied what you are purporting. Race and/or minority membership has absolutely nothing to do with field of study, so stop with the race baiting.
It's a simple logical extension of what you were suggesting. I am not race baiting. I am simply suggesting that we take your axiom that we should only fund those who will be most employable a little further. Or perhaps you only agree with this theorem to a point?
The end goal of college IS job training. It's not a 4 year lesson in personality skills and useless knowledge, at least it shouldn't be.
What you are refering to is "vocational school" not college.
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Originally Posted by andrea3821
If a small school offers that many majors they are spreading themselves WAY too thin. Thee declining enrollment also suggests the students are not too happy with their "useless" choices of major. But you want to subsidize these programs anyway. Why?
That is the point of accreditation. If an educational institution is spreading itself too thin by offering more majors than the faculty can handle, they won't (or shouldn't) get acreddited.
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Originally Posted by andrea3821
Actually, he is spot on. We do not need people to be going out to get a degree just to have one. This phenomenon has devalued education already, it can be hard to find a good job in many fields without at least a bachelor's. Some jobs want you to have A degree, doesn't matter what it's in. This has to stop, pretty soon we'll all need master's degrees to get anywhere in life. That is not how it should be.
Those who do not have the aptitude for a science related degree should find something else to do, there are other majors offered (like education, for example) and plenty of other technical certificates available at community colleges and the like.
I disagree that he is spot on for the simple reason that he expects colleges to fix problems that are none of their making.
People choose to study or not, and they choose majors for a variety of reasons. They often tend to pick something they are familiar with. Maybe they want to take over a family business. Or they go by the number of job offers they see in the paper the year they start applying. Or they are dazzled by a slick internet presentation.
In my experience, the vast majority of kids who major in engineering do not have the faintest idea of what it involves. Some think that if they like working on cars, they should become Mech Es. Then they get all bent out of shape the first year when they find they can't handle the math.
The groundwork for what the kids want to study and are able to study is laid well before the junior year in high school. Skimping on math and science (hell we don't even have a math teacher in our town) shoves the problem into the universities. Why should universities have to offer remedial math? The schools aren't doing their job anymore and without math and science in the schools, you won't have college kids who can handle the first year of coursework.
Add to that how we have glamorized the idea of doing nothing and succeeding. Singing lessons to become an entertainer? Nawww just go on America's Got Talent. Look at all the famous airheads, dipwads and bimbos both male and female who have been successful and who actively downplay a need for education and hard work.
Engineers are the antithesis of most celebrities (read: do nothing, look cute, run your mouth, make big bucks). We have a reputation for being nerdy, socially awkward, not "cool" etc.
Until or unless science and engineering gets better PR, simply trying to funnel kids into those fields long after their ship has sailed is pointless IMO.
It's a simple logical extension of what you were suggesting. I am not race baiting. I am simply suggesting that we take your axiom that we should only fund those who will be most employable a little further. Or perhaps you only agree with this theorem to a point?
So, exactly when did a non sequitur become a logical extension? Would that be an aspect of the critical thinking you were discussing earlier?
technically no major is bad and can be turned into something positive down the line.
problem with rick scott's stupidity is he wants to steer everybody into these fields with jobs, then the field becomes over saturated. let people make up there own minds, this aint china ricky.
Fine and people should find themselves on their own dime. Not the state's.
It's a simple logical extension of what you were suggesting. I am not race baiting. I am simply suggesting that we take your axiom that we should only fund those who will be most employable a little further. Or perhaps you only agree with this theorem to a point?
Logical to a racist liberal maybe.
Nice attempt at race baiting, but I'm not a dumb liberal who falls for such silly tricks. Those tactics might work on your folk, but not me.
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