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Old 07-15-2012, 06:24 PM
 
14,306 posts, read 13,263,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
I don't think so. My girlfriend's a perfect example. She calls herself a Mexican all the time, but she has far more negative things to say about Mexico than positive. She's "proud to be an American" however (ironically, that's something I can't stand to hear people say, and I'm white!... or Anglo-American, whatever the hell I'm allowed to call myself these days...)
Why does she call herself a Mexican assuming she is an American citizen?
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Old 07-15-2012, 06:31 PM
 
14,306 posts, read 13,263,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCCB View Post
My wife refers to whites as crackers. Of course she was born in Mexico and is joking....
She tells me though all prefer to live here, they have a life long loyalty to Mexico.
I think it has to do with it being next door and the ability to access it so easily.

If you compare it to years ago and people through Eilis Island from Europe, they spend a lot, came a long way and it was near impossible to get home. It was a make or break trip. For Mexicans and some from Central America it isn't the same deal.

PS: Was in Africa last month and in parts it was hard to find any black people, so when people refer to themselves as African American, unless they were born there they kind of sound stupid because Africa does not only mean black people by any means.
This is the problem with many of Mexican ancestry in this country. Why a life long loyalty to Mexico? Because it is next door? That makes no sense at all if they are citizens of THIS country. What grinds me is the number of Mexicans and other Latinos who are advocates for illegal aliens simply because most of them are from the same nationality and/or ethnically like themselves. That isn't showing any loyalty to this country and our laws.

Maybe it is time to curb immigration from Mexico if that is where their loyalties lie. You made a good analogy in regards to black Americans. Why would they call themselves African-Americans? It's the same deal when Hispanic-Americans call themselves Mexican-Americans. It is just plain stupid!
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Old 07-15-2012, 06:38 PM
 
9,848 posts, read 8,248,170 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
This is the problem with many of Mexican ancestry in this country. Why a life long loyalty to Mexico? Because it is next door? That makes no sense at all if they are citizens of THIS country. What grinds me is the number of Mexicans and other Latinos who are advocates for illegal aliens simply because most of them are from the same nationality and/or ethnically like themselves. That isn't showing any loyalty to this country and our laws.

Maybe it is time to curb immigration from Mexico if that is where their loyalties lie. You made a good analogy in regards to black Americans. Why would they call themselves African-Americans? It's the same deal when Hispanic-Americans call themselves Mexican-Americans. It is just plain stupid!
Yes, Mexicans and their activist want to have all their families here. If they will starve in Mexico they want them here on our welfare system eating out of our Treasury.
They know it is wrong, but it is their families they don't want to see starve.
Many also file lots of false tax returns for thousands of dollars a year they never earned back.
My wife is a tax payer. She is responsible. I can not say the same thing about many others.

In general we are getting through illegals all the worst people immigrating who wouldn't find work even in Mexico. Not good for us IMO.

We need to fix the borders. We need to make all non-citizens (residents) on an social programs get booted out of the country IMO.

Anyway, I don't hear in general white people call themselves white. I do here some call themselves African Americans which is kind of dumb unless they were born in Africa.
Same for Mexican Americans, my wife was born in Mexico. If someone was born here they are not Mexican Americans.
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Old 07-15-2012, 07:22 PM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,354,137 times
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I'm usually one of the first to say how dumb I think it is for someone to be proud of their roots and heritage, etc. But I wouldn't go so far as to assume it screws with loyalty to the country you're living in. Some people just consider it part of their identity; it's as simple as that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Why does she call herself a Mexican assuming she is an American citizen?
Because Mexican culture is a big part of her upbringing. I'd probably call myself Irish if my mom had've raised me to value that part of our ancestry. Naturally, neither of us would hesitate to call ourselves American either. Just depends on the context of the conversation we're having at the time.

Oh, and don't get me started on illegal immigrants, any of you. This pretty much sums up how I feel about that:


Big Mountain - Border Town - YouTube
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Old 07-15-2012, 09:46 PM
 
14,306 posts, read 13,263,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
I'm usually one of the first to say how dumb I think it is for someone to be proud of their roots and heritage, etc. But I wouldn't go so far as to assume it screws with loyalty to the country you're living in. Some people just consider it part of their identity; it's as simple as that.



Because Mexican culture is a big part of her upbringing. I'd probably call myself Irish if my mom had've raised me to value that part of our ancestry. Naturally, neither of us would hesitate to call ourselves American either. Just depends on the context of the conversation we're having at the time.

Oh, and don't get me started on illegal immigrants, any of you. This pretty much sums up how I feel about that:


Big Mountain - Border Town - YouTube
When pride becomes ethnocentricism then the line has been crossed IMO. When pride in one's ancestry becomes advocating for those of your ethnic/national group here illegally again the line has been crossed IMO. When they start calling their fellow citizens who want our immigration laws respected and enforced all kinds of vile names then the line has been crossed IMO.
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Old 07-15-2012, 10:04 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,666 posts, read 60,184,669 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightbird47 View Post
Why not just not call them anything, just treat them as a fellow human being, and if they bring it up then take your cue? If it matters enough to them they will.
Well,duh.

That's what I do.

This post was in response to someone saying that when they meet a black/African American person, they ASK them which term they prefer. I just said that I would feel weird asking that - which I would. And the reason why I would feel weird is because I DO simply look at them as a human being - not with some color or code word attached.
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Old 07-15-2012, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,666 posts, read 60,184,669 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Quote:
You need to see that in your silence you did enlist in this dysfunction. Naturally your defense is that you did not have the authority as a new hire, to take control of the direction the branch was in. Your instincts know that a web of lies has nothing to do with business & is harmful to all. It's not criminal to not know what to do about it, but withholding the information from upper mgmt for how long makes the entire branch look bad.
I didn't have to be a whistle blower - her manager (our manager actually) was well aware of the problem.

Quote:
The core of the problem is the abuse of the definition of affirmative action, not by this woman, but by leadership and covert racist narratives wheedling it's way in corporate culture. The legal dept in corporate steering mgmt is the culprit.
I agree that upper mgmt was ALSO a problem - but please don't act as if the woman herself didn't KNOW she was milking a system and abusing her position. I mean, she was on her cell phone constantly, missed work, was late, etc. She knew she wasn't a good employee - but she hung on as long as she could - till she was eventually (three years later) fired. She KNEW what she was doing was wrong but she did it because...she could.

Quote:
Between the lines of all you said is the notion that to succeed requires negative competition. To resort to immoral activity to present a face of propriety & distance themselves from responsibility as a means to cover thine arse. The rewards in your company are going to those who avoid looking at and confronting problems honestly. The rewards are going to those who dodge responsibility in leadership roles. This must end. Racism is quite costly, not in the courtroom that all believe. It's the tax imposed in human relations undermining the personal best of all employees & the larger community. See it now?
You're preaching to the choir. I've already voluntarily left the company, in part because of just this sort of thing. I thought, when I was promoted into a management position, that I could make a difference. My branch DID run very smoothly, but we were a small part of a much bigger picture, and I was uninterested in furthering my career in such an environment.

Quote:
Good luck to you, Kathryn. And good luck to this woman you spoke of realizing her true potential, her true aptitude, in whatever field of work she truly belongs. I wish you all to shine on merits. THAT is the true purpose of affirmative action. Not to put a foot on scales favoring one lie over another lie. It's the restoration and defense of truth. Of true meritocracy & the fruit of authentic free market. Not a crime syndicate in lieu of legitimate commerce.
Right on, and thank you.
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Old 07-15-2012, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,666 posts, read 60,184,669 times
Reputation: 100994
I just realized fairly recently that it's offensive to Asians for someone to refer to them as Oriental.

OMG. Can we all just CHILL OUT?

I'm sitting here right now trying to figure out just which group of ancestors I identify with the most - Hmmmm, British, Irish, French, Jewish, Swiss, German, Native American...dang, sometimes I feel like I'm at war with myself! It's like a love/hate thing...and my kids are even more confused. They're descendants of both slaves and slave owners!

This is why I prefer just to drop the racial labels. They're becoming quite ridiculous and unwieldy.
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Old 07-15-2012, 10:59 PM
 
Location: TX
6,486 posts, read 6,354,137 times
Reputation: 2628
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
When pride becomes ethnocentricism then the line has been crossed IMO.
I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
When pride in one's ancestry becomes advocating for those of your ethnic/national group here illegally again the line has been crossed IMO.
Neither me nor my girlfriend advocate illegal immigration, nor have we expressed any more pride in our ancestry (her Mexican, my Irish) than in being an American citizen. But we do acknowledge how silly it is for us as legal American citizens to pretend we have more of a moral right to be here than them. Shouldn't make me disloyal to my country in anyone's eyes for me to admit that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
When they start calling their fellow citizens who want our immigration laws respected and enforced all kinds of vile names then the line has been crossed IMO.
Well, sure. But may I add one more?

When people start saying/implying that a person shouldn't call themselves "Mexican" or "Mexican-American" because they think it means they're expressing some degree of loyalty to Mexico, a line has been crossed, IMO.
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Old 07-15-2012, 11:45 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,897,598 times
Reputation: 15037
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
Just depends on the context of the conversation we're having at the time.
The explanation couldn't be simpler.
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