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Old 11-18-2011, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Midwest
506 posts, read 1,042,845 times
Reputation: 330

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunnysee View Post
Well, this begs for a comment or two about what the most USEFUL degrees are. Besides the obvious...medicine will always be a useful degree, etc....

Computer science degrees will guarantee a job! Becoming a master of Cryptology will, too. These folks, one of which is in my family are much in demand by "data mining" facilities.

NSA, Microsoft and I read that Facebook is even building a "data mining" (snooping on citizens) facility, reportedly in Oregon!

What else? what degrees do, or dang-near do guarantee a job?
If you think any degree guarantees a job, I've got the perfect employer for you:
McDonald's Jobs: Find a Career @ McDonald's
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,009 posts, read 15,209,091 times
Reputation: 3739
Quote:
Originally Posted by rock_chalk View Post
If you think any degree guarantees a job, I've got the perfect employer for you:
McDonald's Jobs: Find a Career @ McDonald's
Unfortunately for your case, due to the very high hurdle to understand the mathematics behind machine learning and data mining and how it's just becoming useful, it is indeed the dot com industry of 2011.

They don't even need me to finish defending before they hire me as a postdoc. That is VERY rare and shows the amount of need in the area.
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
85,053 posts, read 99,058,791 times
Reputation: 31544
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
I agree with this as well. I am planning on sending both of my kids to vocational school even though I do feel that both of them are bright enough to go to college.
Are you not going to let them in on the decision? Is it already made?

*********************

Still waiting Aero. You made your declaration that you were going to prove I had said something six hours ago now. Should have been enough time to go through every one of my posts going back to January 2007.
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Alexandria, VA
2,380 posts, read 2,854,181 times
Reputation: 2832
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
1. Journalism
2. Horticulture
3. Agriculture
4. Advertisting
5. Fashion Design
6. Child/Family Studies
7. Music
8. Mechanical Engineering Technology
9. Chemistry
10. Nutrition
11. Human Resources
12. Theater
13. Art History
14. Photography
15. Literature
16. Art
17. Fine Arts
18. Psychology
19. English
20. Animal Science

No wonder this nation is screwed! Check out how many students graduated with these degrees in the 2008-2009 timeframe! And to think that thousands of students are in DEBT over this crap!

Useless College Majors, From Journalism to Psychology to Theater - The Daily Beast
I disagree with this list because I think it depends on location of the graduate. Some of these degrees are actually necessary for many jobs in certain industries.

For example, there are plenty of jobs for people with degrees in journalism in large metropolitan areas. I've seen many Human Resources degrees in demand in administrative and business job postings. Mechanical engineers have a better chance in Detroit, Tokyo, and other locations that are large in the mechanical industry, for example. Any engineering degree is very invaluable. Graduates with degrees in child and family studies can get into nonprofits (a growing industry, btw), education, and counseling, for example.
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:59 PM
 
Location: Midwest
506 posts, read 1,042,845 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
Unfortunately for your case, due to the very high hurdle to understand the mathematics behind machine learning and data mining and how it's just becoming useful, it is indeed the dot com industry of 2011.

They don't even need me to finish defending before they hire me as a postdoc. That is VERY rare and shows the amount of need in the area.
Hint: SunnySee didn't define the term "degree"
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:13 PM
 
3,007 posts, read 3,260,797 times
Reputation: 2002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I don't think the attitude that one should be prepared to go to college is arrogant and/or pretentious. IMO, the education one gets in high school SHOULD prepare one to enter college, if that is one's choice. Any student with average intelligence can meet the entrance requirements for most colleges (excluding Ivy League, and some others).


And you completely missed my whole point, but thanks for illustrating it nonetheless. Your attitude is exactly what I'm talking about, and which creates so much stress for young kids.

First of all, when did I ever say that one shouldn't go to college if they want to and assuming that they have AT LEAST average intelligence? You fabricated something and then attacked it - I never said any such thing. It doesn't matter if you think a high school education should prepare a student for college - it sometimes does not and cannot, either because the kid doesn't have the academic ability or because they don't have the desire or focus for that sort of thing. What is pretentious and arrogant is the assumption that all kids should go to college when there are numerous and various reasons why they should not.

My point is that there are kids who do NOT have the ability to do college work AND there are also kids who may have the ability but not the desire. It is arrogant and pretentious to promote the value that all kids should attend college or else they are failures in life. As for those with average intelligence - are you sure they should be going to college? Why? I would rather have a talented carpenter than a mediocre, borderline incompetent nurse.

You are also making the assumption in your comment that any kid with at least average intelligence SHOULD go to college. Wrong. Don't you see that that is exactly the attitude that promotes the idea that anyone who doesn't go to college is below average in intelligence? Plenty of intelligent people choose not to attend college, or not to complete college once begun.

Academic intelligence is only one type of intelligence, and it is revered entirely too much in this country. There are many other types of intelligence. That's what needs to be recognized.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:24 PM
 
2,695 posts, read 3,610,569 times
Reputation: 1555
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattypatty View Post
And you completely missed my whole point, but thanks for illustrating it nonetheless. Your attitude is exactly what I'm talking about, and which creates so much stress for young kids.

First of all, when did I ever say that "one" shouldn't go to college if they want to and assuming that they have AT LEAST average intelligence? You fabricated something and then attacked it - I never said any such thing.

My point is that there are kids who do NOT have the ability to do college work AND there are also kids who may have the ability but not the desire. It is arrogant and pretentious to promote the value that all kids should attend college or else they are failures in life. As for those with average intelligence - are you sure they should be going to college? Why? I would rather have a talented carpenter than a mediocre, borderline incompetent nurse.

You are also making the assumption in your comment that any kid with at least average intelligence SHOULD go to college. Wrong. Don't you see that that is exactly the attitude that promotes the idea that anyone who doesn't go to college is below average in intelligence? Plenty of intelligent people choose not to attend college, or not to complete college once begun.

Academic intelligence is only one type of intelligence, and it is revered entirely too much in this country. There are many other types of intelligence. That's what needs to be recognized.
I think the underlying point is that college or not, these kids need to learn a skill. There are definitely 'soft' majors that unless you get a phd and teach leave you unemployable- however- I've met plenty of kids from Penn, Harvard, Stanford that had liberal arts majors working as consultants for major firms. In many cases, the ivy degree was enough polish and the job was taught to them.

But a child that rules out college (which is fine) then needs a plan. They need a skill. They need rudimentaery business accounting skills if they're striking out on their own. Hell, most newly-minted doctors have no idea about the nuts and bolts of running a business, payer-mix and reimbursement rates.

So college is most definitely not the only way- but they're a cottage industry as well. And in some places (like Texas) the liberal arts MRS degree is highly sought after.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:24 PM
 
28,050 posts, read 19,725,054 times
Reputation: 16492
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
I'm saying that a person can unjerk themselves in between jobs or after a swift kick in the butt. Plus, many do quite well as jerks, so long as they make money and establish provable results.
Then why even bring it up in terms of a new hire? People don't want to work with jerks, no matter what their numbers may be. A smart manager knows that.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
85,053 posts, read 99,058,791 times
Reputation: 31544
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattypatty View Post
And you completely missed my whole point, but thanks for illustrating it nonetheless. Your attitude is exactly what I'm talking about, and which creates so much stress for young kids.

First of all, when did I ever say that "one" shouldn't go to college if they want to and assuming that they have AT LEAST average intelligence? You fabricated something and then attacked it - I never said any such thing.

My point is that there are kids who do NOT have the ability to do college work AND there are also kids who may have the ability but not the desire. It is arrogant and pretentious to promote the value that all kids should attend college or else they are failures in life. As for those with average intelligence - are you sure they should be going to college? Why? I would rather have a talented carpenter than a mediocre, borderline incompetent nurse.

You are also making the assumption in your comment that any kid with at least average intelligence SHOULD go to college. Wrong. Don't you see that that is exactly the attitude that promotes the idea that anyone who doesn't go to college is below average in intelligence? Plenty of intelligent people choose not to attend college, or not to complete college once begun.

Academic intelligence is only one type of intelligence, and it is revered entirely too much in this country. There are many other types of intelligence. That's what needs to be recognized.
Cut the snark, pat. "One" is proper English. It's easier than saying He/she.

Who are all these kids who don't have the abilty to go to college? The community colleges have open admission-they'll take anyone. Why shouldn't someone of average intelligence go to college if that is HIS/HER choice, something I emphasized in the post you quoted. What makes you think being a carpenter doesn't take some intelligence, or that ONE can become a carpenter with no education beyond high school?

Carpenters

Carpenters can learn their craft through on-the-job training, vocational schools or technical colleges, or formal apprenticeship programs, which often takes 3 to 4 years.


Education and training. Learning to be a carpenter can start in high school. Classes in English, algebra, geometry, physics, mechanical drawing, blueprint reading, and general shop will prepare students for the further training they will need.

Which of those classes is not college prep as well?

After high school, there are a number of different ways to obtain the necessary training. Some people get a job as a carpenter's helper, assisting more experienced workers. At the same time, the helper might attend a trade or vocational school, or community college to receive further trade-related training and eventually become a carpenter.

Some employers offer employees formal apprenticeships. These programs combine on-the-job training with related classroom instruction. Apprentices usually must be at least 18 years old and meet local requirements. Apprenticeship programs usually last 3 to 4 years, but new rules may allow apprentices to complete programs sooner as competencies are demonstrated.



Once again, I never said everyone SHOULD go to college. I clearly stated, "if that is one's choice".

You are the one making assumptions from my post, so you can express your opinions. You're entitled to your opinions, just don't drag me into them.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:29 PM
 
3,007 posts, read 3,260,797 times
Reputation: 2002
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreyDay View Post
I think the underlying point is that college or not, these kids need to learn a skill. There are definitely 'soft' majors that unless you get a phd and teach leave you unemployable- however- I've met plenty of kids from Penn, Harvard, Stanford that had liberal arts majors working as consultants for major firms. In many cases, the ivy degree was enough polish and the job was taught to them.

But a child that rules out college (which is fine) then needs a plan. They need a skill. They need rudimentaery business accounting skills if they're strikning out on their own. Hell, most newly-minted doctors have no idea about the nuts and bolts of running a business, payer-mix and reimbursement rates.

So college is most definitely not the only way- but they're a cottage industry as well. And in some places (like Texas) the liberal arts MRS degree is highly sought after.

Yes, that's MY underlying point - it's not the underlying point of the person I was responding to.
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