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Old 11-18-2011, 07:10 AM
 
9,617 posts, read 6,059,788 times
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Greece, Italy and now Spain are turning their backs on left and left of center governments that have, for decades, sought to offer a cradle to grave support and safety net, and to provide their union political bases with restrictive to the labor market, and to business, labor laws. This was sustainable as long as growth was 3, 4, 5 % and higher. But slowly, all three have with smothering labor laws and business regulations dampened economic activity. Their GDP growth is in the ~1% range, their general private economic activity is at a standstill. Sound familiar?

So, it is ironic that the three governements that once had their citizenry dependent on them, now, are in turn dependent on the more productive Northern European countries to provide for them.

But, don't trust me. Read about it yourself.
Italy's Labor Pains
Spain goes to the polls as debt fears grow - MarketWatch
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Old 11-18-2011, 07:13 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
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b-b-b-b-b-b-ut...Germany and Sweden?
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Old 11-18-2011, 07:15 AM
 
Location: NC
6,032 posts, read 9,206,866 times
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Actually the GDP is contracting.... 12% of GDP spending is now Government borrowing re-spent to prop the numbers up.

Much of the GDP growth over the last 20 years has been from borrowing. That is why we will have a debt spiral. We reached the saturation point.
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Old 11-18-2011, 07:22 AM
 
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Yes, those counties have what can be called over generous social services. Especially when you consider that the general populations doesn't pay their taxes to pay for those benefits. Italy has always been a large economy basket case. Spain was a fascist dictatorship until the 1980's and Greece was almost like a developing country that had no business joining the Euro.

Bad and loose economic policy combined with high spending, government corruption and low tax receipts is what got these countries to this point.
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Old 11-18-2011, 07:47 AM
 
9,617 posts, read 6,059,788 times
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I don't think any of you are looking at the labor law components here, where trades are closed, contract negotiated annually and nationally, businesses are unnaturally constricted from innovating, etc and so on.

Everything you point out is true, but it is lack of the ability to be productive, both as individuals and as corporations that strangles economies. Slowly, over time.

So that when the government is out of tricks to keep the patient alive, there is nothingness.
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:09 AM
 
Location: Gone
25,231 posts, read 16,928,124 times
Reputation: 5932
Quote:
Originally Posted by earthlyfather View Post
Greece, Italy and now Spain are turning their backs on left and left of center governments that have, for decades, sought to offer a cradle to grave support and safety net, and to provide their union political bases with restrictive to the labor market, and to business, labor laws. This was sustainable as long as growth was 3, 4, 5 % and higher. But slowly, all three have with smothering labor laws and business regulations dampened economic activity. Their GDP growth is in the ~1% range, their general private economic activity is at a standstill. Sound familiar?

So, it is ironic that the three governements that once had their citizenry dependent on them, now, are in turn dependent on the more productive Northern European countries to provide for them.

But, don't trust me. Read about it yourself.
Italy's Labor Pains
Spain goes to the polls as debt fears grow - MarketWatch
Germany has a very Socialist government and they are doing fine, in fact they are doing better than we are.

Last edited by Casper in Dallas; 11-18-2011 at 08:26 AM..
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,274,359 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper in Dallas View Post
Germany has a very Socialist government and they re doing fine, in fact they are doing better than we are.
See post #2.

Germany has a free market system rather than a socialist one.
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,940,856 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
See post #2.

Germany has a free market system rather than a socialist one.
You are confusing Socialism with the Socialist Party.

The current party platform of the Socialist Democratic Party believes in democratic freedom and social justice. In other words, they believe in free markets but liberal social safety nets.
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:28 AM
 
12,669 posts, read 20,439,262 times
Reputation: 3050
Quote:
Originally Posted by earthlyfather View Post
Greece, Italy and now Spain are turning their backs on left and left of center governments that have, for decades, sought to offer a cradle to grave support and safety net, and to provide their union political bases with restrictive to the labor market, and to business, labor laws. This was sustainable as long as growth was 3, 4, 5 % and higher. But slowly, all three have with smothering labor laws and business regulations dampened economic activity. Their GDP growth is in the ~1% range, their general private economic activity is at a standstill. Sound familiar?

So, it is ironic that the three governements that once had their citizenry dependent on them, now, are in turn dependent on the more productive Northern European countries to provide for them.

But, don't trust me. Read about it yourself.
Italy's Labor Pains
Spain goes to the polls as debt fears grow - MarketWatch

But you see these Liberals that are running our Government are smarter than those over there. And what is happening over there would Never happen here we have to many rich people. Who would never move out of this country to another one and take their money with them.
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Old 11-18-2011, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Gone
25,231 posts, read 16,928,124 times
Reputation: 5932
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
See post #2.

Germany has a free market system rather than a socialist one.
Yes, free market, but they ARE still a Socalist country, I know this to be a FACT, I was born there, have relatives there, and travel back to visit and on business at least every couple of years.
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