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Old 11-19-2011, 06:39 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,712 posts, read 11,010,658 times
Reputation: 5600

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
"Stealing", thats what it's called when something is taken from you by force.
I guess if the thief wears a government costume it's okay with you?

Lol at less taxation =anarchy
The United States did not have an income tax until 1913, were we an anarchy up until that point?


You government employees just crack me up.
Oh please. You don't live in a cave free of everything society provides. As such, you are obliged to pay for this society. But it's clear where you stand. Like Paul Krugman wrote:

Quote:
One side of American politics considers the modern welfare state — a private-enterprise economy, but one in which society's winners are taxed to pay for a social safety net — morally superior to the capitalism red in tooth and claw we had before the New Deal. It's only right, this side believes, for the affluent to help the less fortunate.

The other side believes that people have a right to keep what they earn, and that taxing them to support others, no matter how needy, amounts to theft. That's what lies behind the modern right's fondness for violent rhetoric: many activists on the right really do see taxes and regulation as tyrannical impositions on their liberty.
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:44 AM
 
Location: Orlando
8,221 posts, read 10,946,004 times
Reputation: 4022
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTHokieFan View Post
I'm a libertarian, just trying to spur discussion.

Asa true libertarian you will reduce the size of government to 1/3 of what it is and reduce the need to tax so much. Of course unemployment will soar but that's another problem.
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Old 11-19-2011, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Maine
561 posts, read 421,154 times
Reputation: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by jefffla01 View Post
It is time to put this disastorous tax code to sleep and come up with tax reforms---a new system that is more equitable and at least requires the wealthy to contribute something.
Such a proposal already exists. It's called the Fair Tax:

Americans For Fair Taxation: Americans For Fair Taxation
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:06 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,591,148 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
The money used to invest has already been taxed as income.
And since the only way to get a reduced 15% capital gains rate, is if you hold that investment over a year, its often times already taxed by the corporation as well.
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:26 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,712 posts, read 11,010,658 times
Reputation: 5600
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey
The money used to invest has already been taxed as income.
No matter how many times I've corrected you in other threads on that point, you keep repeating the error again. Do you have memory issues?

Capital gains, by it's nature, is a tax on unrealized gains. Someone earned $120 dollars working, paid $20 tax and kept $100. They invested that $100 and earned $180. They never paid tax on the $80 and that's precisely what is subject to capital gains tax.

Yes, "the money used to invest has already been taxed as income," but that money isn't being taxed again, just the gain from that money.

I know how easy it is to just keep repeating the same talking point, even if it is 100% false.
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:41 AM
 
17,015 posts, read 11,381,491 times
Reputation: 8989
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTHokieFan View Post
For the middle class investors, capital gains will be lowered to 10%, the rich will have their capital gains raised to 50%. Thoughts?

Great way to dry up investment in capital and industry. People are not stupid- with that high of capital gains, investment would leave the US and would only hurt the people the plan would be designed to "help".

What should really happen?

Cut corporate taxes and capital gains taxes to 10%. The socialist have it exactly wrong. You cannot tax or confiscate wealth. Wealth is created by industry and initiative, and not the federal government. Besides, when, in the course of US history since ww2, has the US ever "paid down the debt" with any increased revenues (which would be short lived, by the way)?


Want to kill jobs, federal revenue, and buisness in the US? Raise capital gains.
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:48 AM
 
12,439 posts, read 9,951,162 times
Reputation: 3129
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Great way to dry up investment in capital and industry. People are not stupid- with that high of capital gains, investment would leave the US and would only hurt the people the plan would be designed to "help".
Really? You state that you have 25 million, what would you do with the money if you were taxed at 50% capital gains...stick it under your bed? If you invest in foreign investments it still would be taxed at 50%, so what would you do? Move...where would you go? Who pays doctors more than we do? If you want to leave the country, call me. I will help you pack.
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:52 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,591,148 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
No matter how many times I've corrected you in other threads on that point, you keep repeating the error again. Do you have memory issues?

Capital gains, by it's nature, is a tax on unrealized gains. Someone earned $120 dollars working, paid $20 tax and kept $100. They invested that $100 and earned $180. They never paid tax on the $80 and that's precisely what is subject to capital gains tax.

Yes, "the money used to invest has already been taxed as income," but that money isn't being taxed again, just the gain from that money.

I know how easy it is to just keep repeating the same talking point, even if it is 100% false.
You are completely wrong. Dividends for example are REALIZED gains. Its money you put in your pocket, you get to spend. Furthermore, the company that made the $80 is TAXED by the group that made it before its passed onto you.
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Old 11-19-2011, 07:58 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,591,148 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotair2 View Post
Really? You state that you have 25 million, what would you do with the money if you were taxed at 50% capital gains...stick it under your bed? If you invest in foreign investments it still would be taxed at 50%, so what would you do? Move...where would you go? Who pays doctors more than we do? If you want to leave the country, call me. I will help you pack.
I'd buy a $250M property and make sure that 100% of all profits go towards covering debt.

I would earn money every month the debt is paid down, and I wouldnt be subject to taxes. And when its paid down enough, I'd roll it over into a 1031 tax exchange into a $1B property, and STILL pay ZERO taxes. Over time this would turn $25M into $1 BILLION with ZERO TAXES paid.

How do you dispute real life scenarios with your make believe fantasies and how did that work out for the taxpayer?
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Old 11-19-2011, 08:00 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,591,148 times
Reputation: 9357
Quote:
Originally Posted by AONE View Post
Asa true libertarian you will reduce the size of government to 1/3 of what it is and reduce the need to tax so much. Of course unemployment will soar but that's another problem.
Unemployment doesnt soar when you leave more money in the economy than you take out because you leave hundreds of billions for the consumer to spend. Look at the Clinton years for a fine example.
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