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Ummmm...if YOU haven't noticed, let me clue you in... we black folk do NOT think with one planetary brain...there are those of us who choose to (gasp!) attend integrated churches, live in neighborhoods that aren't predominately black, DON'T speak or approve of 'Ebonics', don't always do what the 'Black Caucus' says, and also express pride in actors and actresses of our ethnicity who excel not only on 'BET' and 'TVOne', but on ALL the major broadcast and cable tv networks...
Hallmark created the Mahogany line to, as others here have stated more eloquently than me, cater to a MARKET and make a PROFIT FROM said market...and quiet as it's kept, Kwanzaa is NOT the 'official black holiday' (what a bunch of hot air), and black folk DO buy cards not aimed at themselves all the time...
If you choose to 'say anything about it', I'm not going to waste my time and energy calling you a 'racist', because that exercise in itself is pointless...but I'm also not going to let a bunch of hot air and sour grapes deter me from living a bountiful life, either...you can jump up and down and scream to the skies all day long, but at the end of the day, your screaming will not have affected the lives of myself and my family one iota---and I just might buy a few Mahogany cards just for fun, knowing that there's nothing you or those who think like you can ultimately do about it
Shush - we can't have your kind here on C-D. It disturbs the mental imagery that some members have construed in their heads what the black community looks like and how it communally acts. Better grab a 40 and sit on the stoop waiting for a drive-by before these fine folks have to confront reality.
Why wouldn't a Black person want to share a holiday card with a family member that has a face and culture on it that the family member will relate to?
Do you make the same thread and ask the same question when the White American shopper gets to buy a product that features a White family? So, are we all going to be forced into buying one thing? Should greeting cards not have people on them so we won't even have this question? Should we hide from race instead of just accepting it, yet, respecting one another and not having hate?
Duh, people often like to have meaningful pieces that they can relate to. There is nothing wrong with celebrating differences adn acknowleging one's culture. It's when people can't accept other people's cultures that we have a problem. Basically, let people have their comfort.
I think you misundersand me(my post was kind of clumsy and inarticulate).
Some background to put things in perspective. I am not from the US and have never lived there. I am black and live in a country where black = normal= mainstream. So it strikes me as extremely odd to see Hallmark implying that black (well the American concept of it at least) = different aka not normal (so different that they feel the need to bring out an entire new line to cater for them rather than working diversity into their main line). I can understand that sort of attitude in the US towards a more recent ethnic group like Hispanic or Muslim (not saying it is right either). But why should that exist for a group like the African Americans that has been there since before the founding of the US? Shouldn't their culture be fully worked into mainstream American culture by now thus negating the need for a separate African American line? Integration into mainstream doesn't have to mean complete loss of a culture, just that your cultural contributions are practised by everyone...even those who do not share your ancestry/heritage.
I have realised based on other posters responses however that I was framing the question through my own Caribbean perspective without remembering that segregation ended only recently in the US which should explain the separation of the cultures that exists.
I think you misundersand me(my post was kind of clumsy and inarticulate).
Some background to put things in perspective. I am not from the US and have never lived there. I am black and live in a country where black = normal= mainstream. So it strikes me as extremely odd to see Hallmark implying that black (well the American concept of it at least) = different aka not normal (so different that they feel the need to bring out an entire new line to cater for them rather than working diversity into their main line). I can understand that sort of attitude in the US towards a more recent ethnic group like Hispanic or Muslim (not saying it is right either). But why should that exist for a group like the African Americans that has been there since before the founding of the US? Shouldn't their culture be fully worked into mainstream American culture by now thus negating the need for a separate African American line? Integration into mainstream doesn't have to mean complete loss of a culture, just that your cultural contributions are practised by everyone...even those who do not share your ancestry/heritage.
I have realised based on other posters responses however that I was framing the question through my own Caribbean perspective without remembering that segregation ended only recently in the US which should explain the separation of the cultures that exists.
Glad you came to that realization. Also would like to know since you are black, do you have access to cards in your home country with black people on them?
And why would you think that black is "mainstream." When you think of an American, what sort of features does that American have? I doubt it is a black person other than an entertainer or an athlete.
News flash: Black people in America are different. Many people in America do not view black people in America as normal. Our country has a history of racism, segregation, oppression, and injustice towards people who are not white men.
Also wanted to educate you in the fact that hispanics are not a "new" group in America. They have been here longer than many white Americans in Florida and the SW of the country. Many hispanic families have roots in this country much deeper than the majority of white Americans as the majority of whites are the descendants of recent immigrants in the late 19th early 20th century. I am black and my family has been here since the 1700s. I think it is great that I can get a card that looks similar to the relative I am buying it for. FWIW, when I do buy cards I usually only buy the Mahogany line and I would bet that it is among the most profitable lines that Hallmark has. I only buy non-Mahogany cards when the Mahogany ones are sold out. Usually around the more commercial holidays (Christmas, Valentine's Day, Mother's Day, Easter, Father's Day, etc.) they will be sold out at every store in the vicinity of my neighborhood and I'll have to take a chance and go out to a more white area to buy one.
I guess I'm going to ask one of the most stupid questions on here.
Aren't Caribbeans "black" also?
African americans and the carribeans at my job look the same,whether Hatian,Jamiacan,from Guyana.
Folks from the Caribbean can be of any race as far as those of African descent they generally look the same. However I suspect the average Black Caribbean person had more African admixture than the average Black American.
There are also major differences culturally speaking between the groups as well.
I guess I'm going to ask one of the most stupid questions on here.
Aren't Caribbeans "black" also?
African americans and the carribeans at my job look the same,whether Hatian,Jamiacan,from Guyana.
Caribbean history is broadly speaking very similar to American history. The timeline of the Caribbean is:
Native Americans living there for thousands of yrs followed by European conquest followed by slave labour imported from West Africa followed by abolition of slavery followed by various ethnic groups brought by Europeans to replace the slave labour (Chinese, Indian, Middle Eastern).
Basically an immigrant society(some forced some voluntary). Hence Caribbean people can be any race.
Glad you came to that realization. Also would like to know since you are black, do you have access to cards in your home country with black people on them?
And why would you think that black is "mainstream." When you think of an American, what sort of features does that American have? I doubt it is a black person other than an entertainer or an athlete.
News flash: Black people in America are different. Many people in America do not view black people in America as normal. Our country has a history of racism, segregation, oppression, and injustice towards people who are not white men.
Also wanted to educate you in the fact that hispanics are not a "new" group in America. They have been here longer than many white Americans in Florida and the SW of the country. Many hispanic families have roots in this country much deeper than the majority of white Americans as the majority of whites are the descendants of recent immigrants in the late 19th early 20th century. I am black and my family has been here since the 1700s. I think it is great that I can get a card that looks similar to the relative I am buying it for. FWIW, when I do buy cards I usually only buy the Mahogany line and I would bet that it is among the most profitable lines that Hallmark has. I only buy non-Mahogany cards when the Mahogany ones are sold out. Usually around the more commercial holidays (Christmas, Valentine's Day, Mother's Day, Easter, Father's Day, etc.) they will be sold out at every store in the vicinity of my neighborhood and I'll have to take a chance and go out to a more white area to buy one.
My bad about the Hispanics. Thought the bulk of them came more recently to the US.
Anyways, the Hallmark store I went to here carries some cards from the Mahogany line and those had black people on them. However you have to understand this is much less important as a marketing tool for people who live in a place where black = normal. We are not seen as "different" and wouldn't really seek out such a card actively.
Furthermore a card that is meant to appeal to African Americans may not appeal to blacks from other regions. For eg. there was a Mahogany card that I bought which featured 3 little kids(who happened to be black) singing a carol. I bought it because the kids were cute and I have a friend who loves kids...not because they were black. There was another Mahogany card with a lady on it and the word Diva on the front. Inside were a bunch of Americanisms that wouldnt appeal to anyone who is not American. I believe it was meant to play into the stereotype of the "saucy" African American woman and that stereotype doesn't exist here.That card was largely untouched lol.
To answer the question about what I would expect an American to look like I guess it would depend on where they're from. For eg if I was told I was about to meet a New Yorker I wouldn't really have any pre conceived notions about their race. We (non Americans) know you all much more than you know us so I'm quite aware of how different racial makeup can be based on location in the US.
Folks from the Caribbean can be of any race as far as those of African descent they generally look the same. However I suspect the average Black Caribbean person had more African admixture than the average Black American.
There are also major differences culturally speaking between the groups as well.
The carribeans I had talked with said they were more mixed than black americans.
Idk about cultural differences being that great. They look exactly the same unless they open their mouths. They date each other on the job.
When they get married,is that considered race mixing?(the black americans and black carribeans)?
I guess this is my next dumb question(sorry)
What's wrong with the actual Mahogany line being sold in the Carribean if technically,the people on the cards with the black faces look exactly like you?
Esp the ones without words on it?
I do get your point about them not having a separate line just for black americans though.
Reminds me of black barbie dolls and the need for them.
The two groups have different ideas of beauty.
(Even though IMO the black barbie just looks like a White barbie painted black)
Last edited by jerseygal4u; 12-22-2011 at 08:15 AM..
The carribeans I had talked with said they were more mixed than black americans.
Idk about cultural differences being that great. They look exactly the same unless they open their mouths. They date each other on the job.
When they get married,is that considered race mixing?(the black americans and black carribeans)?
By that logic, a white American of German ancestry living in Pennsylvania is exactly the same as a white Canadian of French ancesty living in Quebec as is a Spanish Jew. They look exactly the same unless they open their mouths.
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), and black folk DO buy cards not aimed at themselves all the time...
