The middle class is suffering and the Republicans want to cut taxes for the wealthy (how much, chairman)
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The GOP is wise about this. They know that it isn't the middle class that writes their own paychecks. This class envy which the left works to whip-up every chance they get is not fooling millions of us.
OMG..why does the right insist this is some kinda of envy of the rich or "class warfare". Stop with the labels already. We all know the ultra rich ($1mil plus) spend good money on accountants to work every single loop hole in that huge tax code book, and keep most of their earnings. This is no secret.
FICA was originally an insurance plan implemented after the Depression to ensure that grandma didn't starve on the street. Nothing wrong with the program in concept.
Another car analogy for you:
You own a Mercedes. Your friend owns a Chevy. You both have them insured. The Mercedes obviously is worth twice as much as the Chevy. Your pays twice as much every month as he does. One day he starts complaining that you should pay even more for your premiums so he can pay less, because you have more money. You of course are not happy. But your friend and all the other Chevy owners decide its only fair.
"If only the rich would pay more, we wouldn't have to pay as much to insure our Chevy's", they chant.
You ask them a simple question: "If my Mercedes is wrecked, do I get to collect more than the value of my Mercedes?".
"Of course not", they cry. "Then who would pay for my Chevy?"
That Cletus, is the SS argument simplified. We can raise the payroll taxes, but because its an insurance program, the people who pay more will benefit more. What the Democrats want is to raise the premiums, but cap the benefit. Warren Buffet probably wouldn't care if he paid payroll tax on all $600,000 of his income, because in theory some day he would get a large SS check. You, on the other hand, want him to pay his premiums on his Mercedes, but get reimbursed like he owned a Chevy.
If only your analogy were true. The fact is, the rich do not pay the same percentage of their earnings as the middle class. They pay far less. They invest in top notch accountants to make sure of that. Accountants the middle class could never afford. If think the ultra rich are paying their fair percentage share of taxes, you are naive.
FICA was originally an insurance plan implemented after the Depression to ensure that grandma didn't starve on the street. Nothing wrong with the program in concept.
No, FICA was a way to pay for social security. Social security is the program that ensures grandma doesn't starve on the street.
The fallacy is assuming that FICA must be used to pay for social security, or that it is even fair or beneficial to do so.
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Another car analogy for you:
You own a Mercedes. Your friend owns a Chevy. You both have them insured. The Mercedes obviously is worth twice as much as the Chevy. Your pays twice as much every month as he does. One day he starts complaining that you should pay even more for your premiums so he can pay less, because you have more money. You of course are not happy. But your friend and all the other Chevy owners decide its only fair.
"If only the rich would pay more, we wouldn't have to pay as much to insure our Chevy's", they chant.
You ask them a simple question: "If my Mercedes is wrecked, do I get to collect more than the value of my Mercedes?".
"Of course not", they cry. "Then who would pay for my Chevy?"
That Cletus, is the SS argument simplified. We can raise the payroll taxes, but because its an insurance program
Uh, yeah stop right there.
Social security is not an insurance program. That's what they tell conservatives, so it won't look like welfare.
If Social security was an insurance program, it would only pay out to people who needed it.
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the people who pay more will benefit more.
Actually the people who pay more benefit less, as a proportion of their giving.
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What the Democrats want is to raise the premiums, but cap the benefit.
Democrats want to lower what you call "the premiums", aka, the payroll tax.
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Warren Buffet probably wouldn't care if he paid payroll tax on all $600,000 of his income
Warren Buffett has about $60 million in annual income, not $600,000.
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because in theory some day he would get a large SS check.
No, in theory, even if we removed the cap he would never get back what he paid in. The benefit formula makes social security very similar to welfare.
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You, on the other hand, want him to pay his premiums on his Mercedes, but get reimbursed like he owned a Chevy.
No, because that's already how it works.
We're drifting here --
but the bottom line is that the FICA+SS system is like welfare for the poor, that middle class pays for, that the rich get to opt most of their income out of.
So it's more like:
-a used Kia
-a new Toyota
-a fleet of new Ferrari's.
The new Toyota drivers' premium ends up paying to support the Kia guys' (due to the benefit formula), while the Ferrari fleet pays almost nothing by opting out of the system (due to the tax cap).
To make things fair you can have everyone pay their own premiums, which will cause a riot amongst the Kia drivers, whose "coverage" will drop down to practically nil... or you could acknowledge the redistributive aspects of the system, bring the Ferrari owners and their premiums in, which reduces the pressure the Toyota drivers face by being forced to fund the Kia drivers.
Last edited by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus; 12-29-2011 at 02:49 PM..
If only your analogy were true. The fact is, the rich do not pay the same percentage of their earnings as the middle class. They pay far less.
Because both the FICA tax and the benefits are CAPPED. The rich pay less of a percentage in FICA tax, but also GET LESS of a percentage of their income in benefits. What do you all not understand about that?
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