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Anyone born in the U.S. to two U.S. citizen parents is a Constitutional natural born citizen. Ancestral heritage and/or ethnicity and/or race have nothing to do with it.
I wonder if some posters are aware that most of us have mixed racial blood in us, somewhere.
Kind of like the fact that Hitler had Jewish relatives.
What? I posted John Jay's letter to Washington, who presided over the Constitutional Convention.
Jay was not a Framer, and he never mentioned split allegiances or obligations to follow foreign laws. He speaks only of foreigners... not of "foreign influence" or "split allegiances" or "foreign laws."
Foreigners.
And as we all know, under US Law, a US citizen (no matter the stripe and no matter how many other citizenship he may hold) cannot be a foreigner.
Come on. You know that. Why do you persist with the lie?
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
Furthermore, while the Convention's Committee on Detail had originally proposed that the President must be merely a citizen, the Committee of Eleven changed "citizen" to "natural born citizen."
Who cares if it was a change from something originally different? Natural born citizen simply did not mean what you claim it means. It had only one meaning in the entire English language at the time of the Framing, and it was not the Birther definition. So the fact that there was a change does not help you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
We've been through this before in another thread. Can you prove that this so-called French citizenship Jefferson supposedly had was actually legal and not just honorary? You know, like those fake honorary degrees colleges bestow on their graduation speakers?
Actually, yes. The list of people given honorary French citizenship during the French Revolution is only 22 names long. While it includes George Washington, Thomas Paine, Alexander Hamilton and James Madison... Thomas Jefferson is not on the list.
His French citizenship was the result of an actual willful naturalization.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
The Framers of the Constitution purposefully included the natural born citizen requirement clause tospecificallyexclude those born with split allegiances and obligations to obey foreign laws from ascending to the highest office of our federal government and military.
That's the Birther claim. But it cannot be reconciled with the language or the historical record. If that was their intention, they would have said so. They certainly would not have gone out of their way to choose a phrase that meant something completely different.
Again, they were not blithering idiots... no matter how resolutely you insist that they were.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
How is it that you who fail to understand why owing allegiance to a foreign country and having to obey a foreign country's laws would be problematic for the President of the United States and our military's Commander in Chief.
We are a sovereign nation. There is no way any foreign nation could require an American President to obey even the most trivial of their laws. They can constrain nothing he does, demand nothing of him, impose no obligation on him.
Your fear here is frankly idiotic. It borders on the insane.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
Failing to understand that completely defies logic.
Irony meters explode across a dozen time zones every time a Birther says something like that.
No, they did not. All they did was deny allegations while providing no corroborating evidence whatsoever supporting the denials. ...the legal equivalent of "Yes, you did," "No, I didn't."
That is, by any definition, testimony under oath.
They do not have to provide corroborating evidence for expert testimony. The testimony is the the evidence.
Natural born Citizens are the descendants of the original citizens. These are the native citizens of the United States. The natural citizens.
Natural born citizens are Anglo Saxons. The 14th Amendment did not create natural born citizens.
Wong Kim Ark was not a natural born citizen. Defendant Obama is not a natural born citizen.
Natural means race. The natural children in the US are the descendants of the original citizens.
When the Framers of the Constitution used the word natural they placed this type of citizen into a Kind.
The President and only the President must be a natural citizen..born from parents who were natural citizens.
This is the meaning of a natural born citizen. Lots of people are going to be disappointed they are not natural born Citizens.
And once again, DraggingCanoe demonstrates that his position is entirely and uncompromisingly racist. Of all the Birthers who have posted here, he is the only one who has so clearly admitted it.
All that said... guess what? Obama has at least eight direct ancestors who fought in the Revolutionary War. He is a descendant of the original citizens.
LOL... no you didn't find it. It does not say that Jefferson's citizenship was honorary. In fact it mentions only the same four that I already posted; Washington, Hamilton, Madison and Paine. The only other American so honored was the poet Joel Barlow.
So did you not read the source you linked to? Or were you just overconfident you could get away with another lie?
And once again, DraggingCanoe demonstrates that his position is entirely and uncompromisingly racist. Of all the Birthers who have posted here, he is the only one who has so clearly admitted it.
All that said... guess what? Obama has at least eight direct ancestors who fought in the Revolutionary War. He is a descendant of the original citizens.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
The Preamble...we give to our posterity. Defendant Obama is not a part of this posterity. Defendant Obama never claimed to be Irish American. He may do a few photo ops at the request of his handlers.
America is not defendant Obama's country. His county is that of is father. Kenya.
Shakespeare must be racist. Chaucer must be racist. George Washington must be racist. John Jay must be racist. Vattel must be racist. Chief Justice Waite must be racist. Chief Justice Fuller must be racist. Chief Justice Marshall must be racist.
Natural born Citizens are the descendants of the original citizens. These are the native citizens of the United States. The natural citizens.
Natural born citizens are Anglo Saxons. The 14th Amendment did not create natural born citizens.
Wong Kim Ark was not a natural born citizen. Defendant Obama is not a natural born citizen.
Natural means race. The natural children in the US are the descendants of the original citizens.
When the Framers of the Constitution used the word natural they placed this type of citizen into a Kind.
The President and only the President must be a natural citizen..born from parents who were natural citizens.
This is the meaning of a natural born citizen. Lots of people are going to be disappointed they are not natural born Citizens.
Actually, all natural born citizens are not Anglo-Saxons; the last Anglo-Saxon king of England was Harold Godwinson, who died in 1066 when William of Normandy invaded England and created a new hierarchy which was most decidedly northern French in origin. French was the national language, along with Latin, until the late 14th century when the language had become a sort of patois which included words from several sources and was given credibility thanks to Chaucer.
Our laws are based in large part on the Magna Carta, signed most reluctantly by King John of England in 1215. Among other things, it's where we gained the right to trial by a jury of our peers. Its influence is seen in The Bill of Rights, Habeus Corpus and our Constitution.
While there were certainly settlers here from England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales, Germans were the largest group. As a professor of Constitutional Law, it's not hard to grasp that President Obama knew when he ran for the State Senate in Illinois that he is an American citizen.
Now it's time for the slow learners to grasp that concept.
Do not paint Shakespeare and Chaucer with a racist brush; Shakespeare's Othello confronts racism and anti-Islamic sentiment, while Chaucer's Canterbury Tales describe the various types of people common in medieval times such as The Miller's Tale, The Knight's Tale and The Wife of Bath. Both writers were very inclusive and nonjudgemental.
Last edited by Evenstar51; 01-05-2012 at 09:22 PM..
Reason: To add info.
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