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Actually yes I have spent a bit of time around some folks like that when I was much younger(not Che's caliber of course)...I didn't agree with them,but I understood them quite well and also WHERE I stood with them....life had a beautiful edge to it back then that I have not felt in 20 yrs or more now...don't miss it,don't regret it either tho.
I think from the many things I have read on Che and things he wrote himself I get the idea that he did have compassion for the common person...that compassion/value did not extend to all walks of life tho.. so although he was hardcore in many ways,he still had a deep compassion for those he believed in....the poor and disenfranchised.
I also think he had MUCH different ideas for Cuba than Castro did and like almost ALL that get power,Castro exploited it worse than those before him and there's a very good chance that that is one of the reasons Che blasted off out of Cuba and joined the fight in Bolivia...he used Castro for funding and some back bone.
I think Che was a war criminal in the end and got what he deserved,but nowdays the world is full of those and they should meet the same end.
Just my opinion.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I get what you're saying and I, sort of, agree with you.
I give up. You win. With you I will always be wrong, or inexperienced or just plain stupid. Why should I subject my self to your constant criticism even if it is invalid? I shouldn't.
BTW, it's a college level art appreciation class that I take at the community college.
all I am doing is asking you to think that's all. it has nothing to do with being right or wrong it is about looking at the entire picture. nothing is black and white. you do yourself a disservice if you close off to the entire picture. which is why I asked you the questions in my last post. can you answer them or do you want to close off to the possibility that some things may be different then you originally thought. what is it about self introspection that has you so worried. are you afraid you will change your mind, or are your beliefs that fragile you won't/can't talk/defend them past the initial thought?
you said you support the arts, why not this project? the questions I asked are relevant and most have nothing to do with inexperience only opinion. a person can be young and have much more knowledge then a older person twice their age. younger people only because they are young and have not had the opportunities to be exposed to other ideas and cultures that might give them a different slant on situations. which is the only thing that stands in their way.
don't grow up to be a closed minded person who can't see the whole picture. your opinion on it can stay the same or not. you don't help your yourself by just accepting things at a face value you see, without asking yourself the "hard" questions you think I ask you.
what is the logic behind not supporting this project?
Actually yes I have spent a bit of time around some folks like that when I was much younger(not Che's caliber of course)...I didn't agree with them,but I understood them quite well and also WHERE I stood with them....life had a beautiful edge to it back then that I have not felt in 20 yrs or more now...don't miss it,don't regret it either tho.
I think from the many things I have read on Che and things he wrote himself I get the idea that he did have compassion for the common person...that compassion/value did not extend to all walks of life tho.. so although he was hardcore in many ways,he still had a deep compassion for those he believed in....the poor and disenfranchised.
I also think he had MUCH different ideas for Cuba than Castro did and like almost ALL that get power,Castro exploited it worse than those before him and there's a very good chance that that is one of the reasons Che blasted off out of Cuba and joined the fight in Bolivia...he used Castro for funding and some back bone.
I think Che was a war criminal in the end and got what he deserved,but nowdays the world is full of those and they should meet the same end.
Just my opinion.
I won't disagree with any of that, except to say that people like Che may be able to feel great sympathy and warmness toward the downtrodden masses, but they won't hesitate a moment to slaughter as many of those same innocents as is necessary for the greater good. It's one of the great evils of our modern times. Before, innocents were killed for the good of an empire or monarchy or The Church, but especially since WWI, they've been sacrificed on the alter of ideology.
all I am doing is asking you to think that's all. it has nothing to do with being right or wrong it is about looking at the entire picture. nothing is black and white. you do yourself a disservice if you close off to the entire picture. which is why I asked you the questions in my last post. can you answer them or do you want to close off to the possibility that some things may be different then you originally thought. what is it about self introspection that has you so worried. are you afraid you will change your mind, or are your beliefs that fragile you won't/can't talk/defend them past the initial thought?
you said you support the arts, why not this project? the questions I asked are relevant and most have nothing to do with inexperience only opinion. a person can be young and have much more knowledge then a older person twice their age. younger people only because they are young and have not had the opportunities to be exposed to other ideas and cultures that might give them a different slant on situations. which is the only thing that stands in their way.
don't grow up to be a closed minded person who can't see the whole picture. your opinion on it can stay the same or not. you don't help your yourself by just accepting things at a face value you see, without asking yourself the "hard" questions you think I ask you.
what is the logic behind not supporting this project?
I think the "young one" as you people call him, is pretty opened minded, as to what a President job is, over a dictator. Not sure, your interruption of being open minded is what he would find of value.
Supporting a man who killed women, even pregnant ones, and children is not someone to even give a platform to.
You people the support Che are the closed-minded ones.
Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by personwhoisaperson
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I get what you're saying and I, sort of, agree with you.
Thanks for looking at all sides
Quote:
Originally Posted by stillkit
I won't disagree with any of that, except to say that people like Che may be able to feel great sympathy and warmness toward the downtrodden masses, but they won't hesitate a moment to slaughter as many of those same innocents as is necessary for the greater good. It's one of the great evils of our modern times. Before, innocents were killed for the good of an empire or monarchy or The Church, but especially since WWI, they've been sacrificed on the alter of ideology.
Yes....I agree with your entire post.
On a sidenote...IMHO It may not be in my time,but I believe the day is rapidly approaching in America where we are going to see the rise of some Che/Castro like characters who will start to slaughter without sympathy or impunity the ones that have become known as "the 1%" ...I think the OWS crowd will eventually spawn those characters too.
On a sidenote...IMHO It may not be in my time,but I believe the day is rapidly approaching in America where we are going to see the rise of some Che/Castro like characters who will start to slaughter without sympathy or impunity the ones that have become known as "the 1%" ...I think the OWS crowd will eventually spawn those characters too.
Given the amount of hatred in this country now along ideological lines, the constant preaching of that hatred by unscrupulous mouthpieces and the identification of other opinions as the "enemy," I'm afraid all it will take to set off roving mobs searching for "liberals" or "right-wingers" to kill is some inconsequential event, some spark to ignite the passions.
People think it can't happen here, but it can. Unless we return to some measure of civility and tolerance for our differences, it seems almost inevitable to me. We can't go on building ideological pressures without an explosion happening at some point.
Maybe we'll get lucky and it will be short-lived and won't lead to the overthrow of our Constitution. I'm not optimistic, though. There are surely individuals lurking in the wings ready to sally forth and "save" America from some perceived enemy, a "saving" which won't retain our democracy but, instead, replace it with a right or left wing tyranny. Or, worse yet, a religious tyranny.
This is who this mural supports this park is one of the most dangerous parks to go to. Your not even allowed if your not one of them..........American taxpayers supporting gangs and La Raza, people who work with drug cartel in Mexico....................
I think the "young one" as you people call him, is pretty opened minded, as to what a President job is, over a dictator. Not sure, your interruption of being open minded is what he would find of value. what are you talking about, this thread is not about a president or dictator this is a thread about art/murals. you want to "throw the baby out with the bath water" because out of thousands of images there is less then a handful of images you don't like. that is closed minded anyway you look at it.
Supporting a man who killed women, even pregnant ones, and children is not someone to even give a platform to.
You people the support Che are the closed-minded ones.
supporting the restoration of these murals have nothing to do with supporting Che.
the space Che has in these murals is limited to about 1/16th of the total overall murals.
would you rather censor the art and have him removed before you would support it's preservation?
This is who this mural supports this park is one of the most dangerous parks to go to. Your not even allowed if your not one of them..........American taxpayers supporting gangs and La Raza, people who work with drug cartel in Mexico....................
not all people who live in the community are criminal nor support criminal activities. there are honest hard working families as well.
Then they should fight to remove the crime. This mural is supported by La Raza. Which, we all know is about "The Race." This has nothing to do with the beaches of San Diego, the culture of California. Watch the video, it says otherwise, who's allowed around the "PARK" and who's not.
Look through parks of California, the reputation of this park. People don't feel safe to have a family picnic, let alone a tourist spot, unless your a gang member that is.
Taxpayers shouldn't reward bad activity, like drug cartels and gang members.
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