U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-26-2012, 12:19 AM
 
Location: Duluth, Minnesota, USA
7,653 posts, read 15,351,410 times
Reputation: 6670

Advertisements

1. Marilyn, a 53-year-old single divorcee who is childless and also a single child of a deceased father and 88-year-old mother with dementia in an assisted living facility. She was laid off in 2008 from a secretarial position, which was replaced with her former boss's attractive 22-year-old girlfriend. After tirelessly searching for work for nearly three years, having her unemployment benefits terminated, and scraping through every last penny of her meager retirement savings, she decided to apply for Social Security Disability on the basis of fibromyalgia and depression. Her fibromyalgia, though, in fact was only minor, and her depression was more or less mild and stemmed from her failed job search. At first rejected, she appealed using the services of a disability lawyer and won her case. She now receives an income of approximately $1,300 a month including her ex-husband's alimony.

Was Marilyn right to apply for SSD?

2. Anna is a 15-year-old female who has recently become sexually active. She lives in a state that runs a program which provides "reproductive health" services free-of-charge. Not wanting her conservative mother to discover her malfeasances, she states on the application that she lives with a friend, and thus all materials are sent to her friend's address. Her friend's mother happens to see the material from the family planning agency addressed to her, but has a tolerant and cooperative attitude towards her, as she is very liberal about those types of things.

Is Anna wrong to falsely state that she lives with her friend in order to receive subsidized birth control and abortion services? Is her friend's mother wrong to cooperate with her?

3. Gorda is the adult daughter of Milagros, who owns a convenience store which Gorda, although having another job and living on her own, sometimes works at. It has come to Gorda's attention that Milagros sometimes rings up cigarettes, chewing tobacco, lottery tickets, fishing bait, transmission fluid, gas, racing fuel, toilet paper, feminine hygiene products, magazines, prepared meals, and alcoholic beverages as similarly-priced food items or combinations of such to allow select customers to use their EBT cards to buy the aforementioned goods. She is certain that he does this, as the owner told her and instructed her that she can make a choice as whether to do the same while she is working.

Does Gorda have any obligation to report Milagros's fraud to the proper authorities? Can she follow Milagros's practices?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-26-2012, 08:13 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia
11,888 posts, read 10,400,323 times
Reputation: 8055
1. She is not wrong to apply. What is wrong is that depression is so easily diagnosed by Doctors eager to get "government paid patients" and is overused as a disability in the Medical/Welfare system. It is a real thing, no doubt, but often it stems from temporary circumstances and should not be seen as a "disability". Everyone is depressed sometimes. Marilyn has exausted her options and is taking advantage of a broken system.

2. I feel that Anna is being responsible for her actions although she went about it the wrong way. She is way too young to not be talking to her parents and her friend's mother is wrong for not talking to Anna's parents or at least pleading with Anna to.

3. Gorda has no obligation to report her father. The obligation lies with Milagros, so long as Gorda does not follow suit when she works. Although, I suspect that this practice is much less common than people believe. The same card is used for Food Stamp and Cash benefits, so they could be using the Cash portion of their card.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-26-2012, 08:33 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,090 posts, read 10,767,632 times
Reputation: 4109
1. The disease is not what classifies people for disability, it is weather a person can work. She has worked with the disorders and can work with them. She wouldn't get disability in the first place, the example is disingenuous.

2. Depends on the situation. It seems like she was wrong in the expected reaction, but if she is going to do those activities it is better to be protected. People can rant and rave about what she shouldn't be doing, but if it's going to happen it would be better if she got out of the teenage years without a disease or a kid.

I have seen some very radically different reactions to seeking out that help. It doesn't surprise me kids would be scared. Most parents aren't happy but realize it is better to be protected and will do it. One friend with a very religious family was a scary example, as her dad beat her with a belt and expelled her from the house for getting protection after asking for their help while they refused.

Education and access instead of ignorance has been proven time and time again to lead to lower rates of poverty, pregnancies, STD/HIV/AIDS, higher graduation rates, and fewer single parent homes. Seems like a dollar of protection is worth more then decades of public support for people.

3. It's fraud, it should be reported and prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Might be good if she found a new job first, if it is a sole proprietorship the store is likely to be seized.

So do you have any more right wing points you wish to hit upon?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-27-2012, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Duluth, Minnesota, USA
7,653 posts, read 15,351,410 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvdxer View Post
1. Marilyn, a 53-year-old single divorcee who is childless and also a single child of a deceased father and 88-year-old mother with dementia in an assisted living facility. She was laid off in 2008 from a secretarial position, which was replaced with her former boss's attractive 22-year-old girlfriend. After tirelessly searching for work for nearly three years, having her unemployment benefits terminated, and scraping through every last penny of her meager retirement savings, she decided to apply for Social Security Disability on the basis of fibromyalgia and depression. Her fibromyalgia, though, in fact was only minor, and her depression was more or less mild and stemmed from her failed job search. At first rejected, she appealed using the services of a disability lawyer and won her case. She now receives an income of approximately $1,300 a month including her ex-husband's alimony.

Was Marilyn right to apply for SSD?
The moral problem lies in whether or not she substantially exaggerated her conditions. The Social Security Administration defines a disabled person as one incapable of sustaining significant gainful activity; but their definition would seem to be contradicted by the fact that they let people "try" work while on it, and many who have rather severe conditions that would readily qualify for SSDI do work and work well, so their definition is really an ideal and not practical. It would perhaps be more apt to say that those who cannot sustain employment without grave inconvenience are eligible, which would include those who work heroically despite having a severe disability.

Quote:
2. Anna is a 15-year-old female who has recently become sexually active. She lives in a state that runs a program which provides "reproductive health" services free-of-charge. Not wanting her conservative mother to discover her malfeasances, she states on the application that she lives with a friend, and thus all materials are sent to her friend's address. Her friend's mother happens to see the material from the family planning agency addressed to her, but has a tolerant and cooperative attitude towards her, as she is very liberal about those types of things.

Is Anna wrong to falsely state that she lives with her friend in order to receive subsidized birth control and abortion services? Is her friend's mother wrong to cooperate with her?
All contraceptives and abortion are forbidden by natural law.

Quote:
3. Gorda is the adult daughter of Milagros, who owns a convenience store which Gorda, although having another job and living on her own, sometimes works at. It has come to Gorda's attention that Milagros sometimes rings up cigarettes, chewing tobacco, lottery tickets, fishing bait, transmission fluid, gas, racing fuel, toilet paper, feminine hygiene products, magazines, prepared meals, and alcoholic beverages as similarly-priced food items or combinations of such to allow select customers to use their EBT cards to buy the aforementioned goods. She is certain that he does this, as the owner told her and instructed her that she can make a choice as whether to do the same while she is working.

Does Gorda have any obligation to report Milagros's fraud to the proper authorities? Can she follow Milagros's practices?
This is a case of passive cooperation in evil, and cannot be solved so easily. I would reckon that she is not obligated because the possible damage to her (estrangement from her father, ruined relationship, etc.) would outweigh the rather small loss to the state from permitting the fraud to continue. However, I've heard some moralists say that no private loss can outweigh loss to general society, or something like that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-27-2012, 06:03 PM
 
47,573 posts, read 60,679,370 times
Reputation: 22283
1. Marilyn probably shifted her mother's home and other assets into her own name 5 years before trying to get Medicaid to pay for her mother's care and she should have been able to get at least half of her husbands assets from their marriage, a paid off house, and could sell her mother's home and if she's careful about spending should do okay until her social security checks begin arriving.

2. Anna should not kill her child. There are plenty alternatives to killing a child she doesn't want, many couples would be very happy to adopt the infant.

3. Gorda should report the food stamp fraud and get Milagros deported.

Honesty is always the best policy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-27-2012, 06:08 PM
 
9,881 posts, read 9,046,421 times
Reputation: 2879
I am not sure how Marilyn got benefits when I personally know of people who cannot possibly engage in gainful employment be turned down for SSI.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-27-2012, 11:36 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,121 posts, read 26,703,943 times
Reputation: 16255
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
1. Marilyn probably shifted her mother's home and other assets into her own name 5 years before trying to get Medicaid to pay for her mother's care and she should have been able to get at least half of her husbands assets from their marriage, a paid off house, and could sell her mother's home and if she's careful about spending should do okay until her social security checks begin arriving.
And if her mother didn't have any assets?

Quote:
2. Anna should not kill her child. There are plenty alternatives to killing a child she doesn't want, many couples would be very happy to adopt the infant.
It didn't mention anything about getting an abortion.... sounds to me she just wants a pelvic exam and some birth control.

Quote:
3. Gorda should report the food stamp fraud and get Milagros deported.

Honesty is always the best policy.
Who said anything about Milagros not being a citizen? Or do you advocate deporting anyone with a foreign sounding name?

You really took these little stories to a whole new level.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-28-2012, 12:37 AM
 
Location: California
30,707 posts, read 33,507,042 times
Reputation: 26137
Quote:
All contraceptives and abortion are forbidden by natural law.
... not US law
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-28-2012, 05:37 AM
 
Location: Austin
29,546 posts, read 16,505,494 times
Reputation: 8087
Eliminate all of those government programs and you could control the fraud much better.

Charity should be a private enterprise.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-28-2012, 05:54 AM
 
Location: Connecticut
1,144 posts, read 1,826,239 times
Reputation: 1339
The case of Miss PJ, a Payroll Administrator for over 30 years, employment terminated when employer filed chapter 7 and closed in July of 09. Applied for numerous jobs over the past 2 1/2 years not only in the field of Payroll but grocery store jobs, convenience store jobs, dollar store jobs, data entry jobs and housekeeping in hotels. Still unemployed, ran out of unemployment 6 months ago, living off my savings account which isnt going to last 6 years, hasnt had medical since 09 as COBRA is not allowed when companies close down the company must be viable and open.
Since I have had depression for 20 years and a slight problem with my liver due to chemotherpay maybe I should apply for SSI.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:42 AM.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top