City-Data Forum Contrails or Chemtrails? (wage, good news, weapons, economic)
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02-19-2012, 06:22 PM
 Location: Tyler, TX 15,202 posts, read 18,261,876 times Reputation: 8032

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 Ok, give me a Las Vegas air temperature you feel conformable with when it would be just too warm at 30,000 for contrails to form. You don't like 70°F so I will give you another 10 degrees and say 80°F. How about another 10 degrees and say 90°F. Hell, I feel generous today I will give you 100°F ground air temp which is 30°F above what I calculated. By my calculations the air temperature at 100°F or 37.78°C would work out to -22.22°C at 30,000 feet ... almost 20°C above the -40°C that's required for contrails to form.

One more time - a temperature of -40 is NOT required for a contrail to form. Period. YOU'RE WRONG. Do you want to see just how wrong you are?

Calculations of Aircraft Contrail Formation Critical Temperatures
Quote:
 To derive the critical temperatures for contrail formation, one must first determine the tangent point of the saturation vapor pressure curve (with respect to water) and a line with a slope equal to the contrail factor, converted to units of vapor pressure per degree (see Fig. 1). At this point, the first derivative of the saturation curve is equal to the slope of the path along which an aircraft wake parcel returns to ambient conditions for the warmest possible condition of contrail formation: where esat(T) (mb) is the saturation vapor pressure with respect to water, CF(g kg−1 K−1) is the contrail factor, and p (mb) is the atmospheric pressure. The temperature that satisfies Eq. (1) is the critical temperature at an ambient relative humidity of 100%, Tc,100. The next step is to find the critical temperature at any relative humidity Tc,RH. The equation for the line of critical temperatures can be defined since a point on the line (Tc,100) and its slope, which is equivalent to the engine contrail factor (in units of vapor pressure per degree), are known. The equation for this line is Using Eq. (2) in an approximate equation for relative humidity (valid for esat p), yields the expression This equation can be solved iteratively to find the critical temperature for any relative humidity Tc,RH and any pressure level.
So you see, Don, determining the temperature at which a contrail can form is just a little more complicated than "-40°C or less."

02-19-2012, 06:25 PM
 Location: Tyler, TX 15,202 posts, read 18,261,876 times Reputation: 8032
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 No, not really. I never said what my profession is.
No, you didn't. Clearly, it's not anything having to do with science or aviation.

02-19-2012, 06:26 PM
 5,113 posts, read 4,956,023 times Reputation: 1732
Quote:
 Originally Posted by swagger One more time - a temperature of -40 is NOT required for a contrail to form. Period. YOU'RE WRONG. Do you want to see just how wrong you are? Calculations of Aircraft Contrail Formation Critical Temperatures So you see, Don, determining the temperature at which a contrail can form is just a little more complicated than "-40°C or less."
LOL

02-19-2012, 06:27 PM
 15,924 posts, read 17,423,331 times Reputation: 7641
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 Disingenuous means you are not interested in the effort here to discuss and collaborate in the subject matter. We have answered your questions but you don't consider or honestly argue the content, you just throw it aside and continue your quest to sidetrack true discussion. You just want us to stop discussing the subject and you try anything you can to accomplish that goal. This is typical Troll actions. As far as getting traction on the subject and the truth I think we are progressing well despite you and swagger's attempts to derail the thread. I think we have presented some very good evidence and theories. I'm more convinced now that geo-engineering is real, the alleged contrails are chemtrails ... and the world governments are operating this secret covert program.
All you want is a bunch of bobbing heads to pat you on the head and say "gee don, you are absolutely 100% correct"

I love the way you describe yourself as "we"

So when are we getting our trip on a chemical spraying aircraft?

With so many facts you have posted to be proved wrong you still want to continue this farce?

I'm up for it.

Calling me a troll over and over, I'm so proud of your labeling don9.... I appreciate it

02-19-2012, 06:28 PM
 Location: Tyler, TX 15,202 posts, read 18,261,876 times Reputation: 8032
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 ... and the world governments are operating this secret covert program.
Which ones? What governments are involved?

02-19-2012, 06:30 PM
 5,113 posts, read 4,956,023 times Reputation: 1732
Quote:
 Originally Posted by plwhit All you want is a bunch of bobbing heads to pat you on the head and say "gee don, you are absolutely 100% correct" I love the way you describe yourself as "we" So when are we getting our trip on a chemical spraying aircraft? With so many facts you have posted to be proved wrong you still want to continue this farce? I'm up for it.
You have not sent me your information ...

02-19-2012, 06:30 PM
 Location: Tyler, TX 15,202 posts, read 18,261,876 times Reputation: 8032
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 LOL
LOL? That's it? So are you sticking with your "40° or less" nonsense?

02-19-2012, 06:31 PM
 15,924 posts, read 17,423,331 times Reputation: 7641
Quote:
 Originally Posted by swagger Which ones? What governments are involved?
He was asked that a few hundred posts ago and never gave an answer then, what makes you think he's going to give one now?

02-19-2012, 06:33 PM
 5,113 posts, read 4,956,023 times Reputation: 1732
Quote:
 Originally Posted by swagger Which ones? What governments are involved?
Any government that knowingly allows chemtrails in their airspace ... But the central government is the UN.

02-19-2012, 06:33 PM
 Location: Tyler, TX 15,202 posts, read 18,261,876 times Reputation: 8032
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Don9 You have not sent me your information ...
You claimed you could deliver a ride in a chemtrail plane. Nobody's giving up their anonymity for nothing, Don. Prove you can deliver, and I'm sure you'll have a line of people out the door willing to let you bg check them for a ride...
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