Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We entered an era of a slowdown in 2001 that lasted several years. Then the thin sheet of ice, we were dancing on for couple of years, gave way in Summer 2008. It will take a long time to recover. The job growth has been anemic since 2001. Nothing puts a better perspective than acceptance that labor force grew by over 10 million between 2001 and 2008 (before the collapse) whereas private sector payroll expanded by only a third of that. But this is something many around here call “full employment” because all they see is “but official unemployment rate was low”. And these would be the same folks coming now to downplay that official unemployment rate.
If we want things to be better, we ought to set realistic expectations and contribute towards it. We’re in this for a long haul… unless it is about loving the idea of another bubble and bust (which can surely benefit a few, but disastrous for the society as a whole).
Excuses, excuses...When obama got in office, he had...'THE PLAN'...HE was going to guide this country to prosperity once again...with CHANGE and TRANSPARENCY. He even said 'Hey, if the economy is still bad after 3 years of my term, then I don't DESERVE to win re-election'...Now...that is a FACT....and I agree...he DOESN'T deserve a 2nd term.
Here is a few more facts for you to mull over...
The housing bubble was created by a policy that was hatched during the Clinton years that basically stated that ALL Americans have the right to own a house of they want to. So, under the 'ASStute' guidance of Barney Frank, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac backed mortgages to people who had no BUSINESS buying a house...because they did not have the means to pay for it. So who is left holding the bag on all of the bad loans?? We are...the taxpayer. And so this democrat created house of cards failed and came crashing down.....and along with it, the banking / insurance crisis began...and the economy followed all of that into the toilet. And all along, the dems defended Freddie and Fannie: *VIDEO FLASHBACK* Democrats Fiercely Defend Fannie Mae And Freddie Mac While Republicans Try To Rein Them In « The Daley Gator
So what is obama's response? Throw $$ at it. That is his response to everything. He has no plan going forward...only the here and now, and even a complete moron could throw $$ at a problem for a quick fix..even George Bush tried it. But long range? NADA. Now just how long will it be before THIS house of cards comes tumbling to the ground??
As it stands, this nation is $16 TRILLION in the hole...and that grows daily. We don't take in enough revenue daily to pay the interest on loans from China AND keep the government running at the same time. And what could the plan going forward POSSIBLY be? Well...it can only go one way can't it? Eventually taxes will have to be raised. And, since we are in a recession with no end to it in sight, when taxes are raised that will compound all of the problems we face right now.
The obama plan is to 'make the rich pay their fair share'. So....we tax the SH*T out of the 1%'ers.....will that make the deficit go away? No...it won't. Because the simple fact of the matter is that washington has spent us into oblivion, and the ONLY way out will be to raise taxes on EVERYONE to the point that the coming recession will make the current one look like a holiday.
Now...having said all of this, the government under obama continues to GROW. That means MORE of the current and future revenue goes to pay for government programs..government services..blah, blah, blah...and there is nothing left to pay the deficit down. I call that IRRESPONSIBLE and CLUELESS leadership.
What is needed is a reduction in the size and scope of government. We need a tax system that is FAIR...we need to get rid of loopholes that allow corporations and anyone who can afford a high priced tax attorney to get by without poaying their fair share. Much like obama's good buddy jeffrey immelt...the CEO of GE...a company that paid $0 in corporate tax in 2010. And obama carps on about the rich not paying their fair share while his bestest golfing buddy screwes the system with a loophole? is that good leadership? No...it isn't.
In the end, what this country is SORELY lacking is a leader who has common sense...one who knows that we cannot continue to print $$ and think that as long as the printer doesn't run out of ink, then all is well. The liberals talk about the economy recovering...HA! Where? A few spikes here and there and they are whistling Dixie that the recession is over and obama is a hero. I find that to be a laughable position.
True unemployment figures...not the ones the government gives..are STAGGERING. Gas / Energy prices are exploding, which will drive the price of goods and services UP...and all the while the value of our dollar is being compromised by a debt that cannot be paid down...meaning our dollar is worth less and less and goods and services will be costing more and more.
How long can this sustain? How can liberals and the media be preaching that the recession is easing...that the unemployment rate is going down...when in fact, it is NOT. How can people be so stupid and blind to NOT see what is happening right in front of them?
Setting realistic expectations is definitely the way to go. I agree with you. But the FACT is that if we don't get a change of direction in this government, we can EXPECT things to get a whole lot worse.
You need to read it again. The article isn't using 54 as the upper limit on the participation, it's simply saying that people within that 25-54 make up only a SMALL PART of the the drop - and that the MAJORITY of the drop is from folks OUTSIDE of that age group (in other words those YOUNGER than 25 or OLDER than 54 (ie between 55-64). Here's the "54" statement you are referring to:
"“Only about a third of the drop in the labor force participation rate is accounted for by those who say they want a job, and only about 15% by those who want a job and are also of prime working age – i.e., between 25-54,”
Again - In OTHER WORDS the BULK of the drop (85%) in the participation rate is from those either YOUNGER or OLDER than 25-54 (ie the article states that the very folks you say are "excluded" are the ones who make up the BULK of those who left the labor force). You have it EXACTLY backwards.
Oh, and it's NOT "Time's number's" - it's BARCLAYS' report.
Ken
It is not Barclay's report. It is a synopsis tailored to help Obama. The PRIME WORKING AGE is not 25 to 54. It is more like 21 to 64. BIG difference. Who doesn't get a job after college unless one is not available? Who stops working at 54 unless they get laid off and can't find a job?
Excuses, excuses...When obama got in office, he had...'THE PLAN'...HE was going to guide this country to prosperity once again...with CHANGE and TRANSPARENCY. He even said 'Hey, if the economy is still bad after 3 years of my term, then I don't DESERVE to win re-election'...Now...that is a FACT....and I agree...he DOESN'T deserve a 2nd term.
Here is a few more facts for you to mull over...
The housing bubble was created by a policy that was hatched during the Clinton years that basically stated that ALL Americans have the right to own a house of they want to. So, under the 'ASStute' guidance of Barney Frank, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac backed mortgages to people who had no BUSINESS buying a house...because they did not have the means to pay for it. So who is left holding the bag on all of the bad loans?? We are...the taxpayer. And so this democrat created house of cards failed and came crashing down.....and along with it, the banking / insurance crisis began...and the economy followed all of that into the toilet. And all along, the dems defended Freddie and Fannie: *VIDEO FLASHBACK* Democrats Fiercely Defend Fannie Mae And Freddie Mac While Republicans Try To Rein Them In « The Daley Gator
So what is obama's response? Throw $$ at it. That is his response to everything. He has no plan going forward...only the here and now, and even a complete moron could throw $$ at a problem for a quick fix..even George Bush tried it. But long range? NADA. Now just how long will it be before THIS house of cards comes tumbling to the ground??
As it stands, this nation is $16 TRILLION in the hole...and that grows daily. We don't take in enough revenue daily to pay the interest on loans from China AND keep the government running at the same time. And what could the plan going forward POSSIBLY be? Well...it can only go one way can't it? Eventually taxes will have to be raised. And, since we are in a recession with no end to it in sight, when taxes are raised that will compound all of the problems we face right now.
The obama plan is to 'make the rich pay their fair share'. So....we tax the SH*T out of the 1%'ers.....will that make the deficit go away? No...it won't. Because the simple fact of the matter is that washington has spent us into oblivion, and the ONLY way out will be to raise taxes on EVERYONE to the point that the coming recession will make the current one look like a holiday.
Now...having said all of this, the government under obama continues to GROW. That means MORE of the current and future revenue goes to pay for government programs..government services..blah, blah, blah...and there is nothing left to pay the deficit down. I call that IRRESPONSIBLE and CLUELESS leadership.
What is needed is a reduction in the size and scope of government. We need a tax system that is FAIR...we need to get rid of loopholes that allow corporations and anyone who can afford a high priced tax attorney to get by without poaying their fair share. Much like obama's good buddy jeffrey immelt...the CEO of GE...a company that paid $0 in corporate tax in 2010. And obama carps on about the rich not paying their fair share while his bestest golfing buddy screwes the system with a loophole? is that good leadership? No...it isn't.
In the end, what this country is SORELY lacking is a leader who has common sense...one who knows that we cannot continue to print $$ and think that as long as the printer doesn't run out of ink, then all is well. The liberals talk about the economy recovering...HA! Where? A few spikes here and there and they are whistling Dixie that the recession is over and obama is a hero. I find that to be a laughable position.
True unemployment figures...not the ones the government gives..are STAGGERING. Gas / Energy prices are exploding, which will drive the price of goods and services UP...and all the while the value of our dollar is being compromised by a debt that cannot be paid down...meaning our dollar is worth less and less and goods and services will be costing more and more.
How long can this sustain? How can liberals and the media be preaching that the recession is easing...that the unemployment rate is going down...when in fact, it is NOT. How can people be so stupid and blind to NOT see what is happening right in front of them?
Setting realistic expectations is definitely the way to go. I agree with you. But the FACT is that if we don't get a change of direction in this government, we can EXPECT things to get a whole lot worse.
Example of an irrational response. When you can do better... then respond to my post. Thanks.
The debt I was referring to was only under BO, not previous debt. This thread is about a particular article not BO's attributions. So treat anything I say as a myth, if it suits you. *shrug*
I know, hence the challenge. Perspective is better avoided and ignored by y'all.
Location: planet octupulous is nearing earths atmosphere
13,621 posts, read 12,730,207 times
Reputation: 20050
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor
Gold is a commodity like any other. It's in a bubble - and it will crash again - just like it did in the early 80's.
Ken
i doubt it.!!!!^^^ fluxuate yes, but crash no.. gold is universal curency and you cant print it.. soon most countries will catch on to the dollar printing scam. and thats when shhitt will hit the fans, and unemployment will skyrocket..
it's estimated that there's only 54 thousand tones of recoverable gold in the ground, and twenty million tones in the oceans. gold is finite.. dollars can be printed for ever.. and as far as the gold in the oceans there is no practical technowlogy to extract it,, until then gold will only go up in the long run..
It is not Barclay's report. It is a . The PRIME WORKING AGE is not 25 to 54. It is more like 21 to 64. BIG difference. Who doesn't get a job after college unless one is not available? Who stops working at 54 unless they get laid off and can't find a job?
WRONG!
"Prime Working Age" is a DEFINED and widely-used economic term that is SPEFICALLY worded as referring to those between the ages of 25 to 54. It's widely used term that is specifically used to refer to THAT specific age group. What YOUR definition is of the term is unimportant.
"Definition of Prime Working Age:
Measure a: Percent of Prime Working Age Population Employed
Description:
Percent of 25 to 54 year-olds who are employed either full-time or part-time at the time of the State Population Survey."
PS - and NO it's NOT "a synopsis tailored to help Obama". the SAME thing appears in Republican Steve Forbe's magazine (You, know - the guy who ran for PRESIDENT as a REPUBLICAN in 1996) - as well as a whole host of OTHER major sources :
You need to take off your silly tinfoil hat (getting an education sure wouldn't hurt either - and NO an education is NOT defined as "listening to lectures by Rush Limbaugh").
Last edited by LordBalfor; 03-15-2012 at 11:22 AM..
i doubt it.!!!!^^^ fluxuate yes, but crash no.. gold is universal curency and you cant print it.. soon most countries will catch on to the dollar printing scam. and thats when shhitt will hit the fans, and unemployment will skyrocket..
it's estimated that there's only 54 thousand tones of recoverable gold in the ground, and twenty million tones in the oceans. gold is finite.. dollars can be printed for ever.. and as far as the gold in the oceans there is no practical technowlogy to extract it,, until then gold will only go up in the long run..
That's the same stoooopid answers people gave back in 1979 - right before gold plummitted from over $800/ounce down to $400/ounce (most of that fall in a matter of days) and STAYED THERE for 25 YEARS.
That's the same stoooopid answers people gave back in 1979 - right before gold plummitted from over $800/ounce down to $400/ounce (most of that fall in a matter of days) and STAYED THERE for 25 YEARS.
Ken
True but for a few differences now, China a country where until this year the population could not own precious metals. Now the government is letting the Chinese people buy all the gold and silver they can afford. This brings in 2.5 billion new customers in to account. Gold is in decline, Africa is not producing the amount of gold it use to. Also right now Germany, Switzerland, and most European countries are trying to get their physcial gold back home. Most of there gold is held in New York, those countries are watching the US print more dollars and they don't want for the US to sell there gold and pay them with dollars. If you go to Zerohedge.com and read the post from all over the world you will see how the Central Banks are now buying gold as fast as they can.
If you check the Comex for the price of gold you will get the paper price but go to ebay and then check the price and you will find it 100 to 200 dollar more. It is estimated that for every one ounce of physcial gold there is 100 ounces of paper thus the spot price reflects the paper price. All the gold held in by the big banks in there vaults may not be there when you try to convert your paper. Look and MF Global, one customer had bought and paid for his metals (gold and silver) the metals were on the loading dock fixing to be sent to the customer when an government agent stopped the loading and had the metal returned to the vault. The customer is still waiting for his metal or his money which if lucky will be pennies on the dollar.
Last edited by SilverOne; 03-15-2012 at 10:28 PM..
True but for a few differences now, China a country where until this year the population could not own precious metals. Now the government is letting the Chinese people buy all the gold and silver they can afford. This brings in 2.5 billion new customers in to account. Gold is in decline, Africa is not producing the amount of gold it use to. Also right now Germany, Switzerland, and most European countries are trying to get their physcial gold back home. Most of there gold is held in New York, those countries are watching the US print more dollars and they don't want for the US to sell there gold and pay them with dollars. If you go to Zerohedge.com and read the post from all over the world you will see how the Central Banks are now buying gold as fast as they can.
If you check the Comex for the price of gold you will get the paper price but go to ebay and then check the price and you will find it 100 to 200 dollar more. It is estimated that for every one ounce of physcial gold there is 100 ounces of paper thus the spot price reflects the paper price. All the gold held in by the big banks in there vaults may not be there when you try to convert your paper. Look and MF Global, one customer had bought and paid for his metals (gold and silver) the metals were on the loading dock fixing to be sent to the customer when an government agent stopped the loading and had the metal returned to the vault. The customer is still waiting for his metal or his money which if lucky will be pennies on the dollar.
MF Global should be a lessen learned there. I don't see a real trend to divest of gold.
True but for a few differences now, China a country where until this year the population could not own precious metals. Now the government is letting the Chinese people buy all the gold and silver they can afford. This brings in 2.5 billion new customers in to account. Gold is in decline, Africa is not producing the amount of gold it use to. Also right now Germany, Switzerland, and most European countries are trying to get their physcial gold back home. Most of there gold is held in New York, those countries are watching the US print more dollars and they don't want for the US to sell there gold and pay them with dollars. If you go to Zerohedge.com and read the post from all over the world you will see how the Central Banks are now buying gold as fast as they can.
If you check the Comex for the price of gold you will get the paper price but go to ebay and then check the price and you will find it 100 to 200 dollar more. It is estimated that for every one ounce of physcial gold there is 100 ounces of paper thus the spot price reflects the paper price. All the gold held in by the big banks in there vaults may not be there when you try to convert your paper. Look and MF Global, one customer had bought and paid for his metals (gold and silver) the metals were on the loading dock fixing to be sent to the customer when an government agent stopped the loading and had the metal returned to the vault. The customer is still waiting for his metal or his money which if lucky will be pennies on the dollar.
Feel free to invest all you want in gold. Just saying that as a student of history it's all happened before - not just with gold but with ANY commodity - be it gold or tulip bulbs, the more frantic the buying mania - the more sobering the morning-after hangover. Gold is in a classic bubble - driven by the expectation that the dollar will collapse and that we'll be facing hyper-inflation. Problem is, it WON'T collapse and hyper-inflation is NOT about to occur -and when folks wise up to those facts, the bubble will burst and chances are it will burst FAST.
Ken
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
:
