Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Its not naive. Its republican. This is how they think. They would rather some fat cat make tons of money and many others suffer through life. Its exactly how royals felt in the past. The problem is the peasants in this country keep voting for them.
It's worse that. To say "this is how they think" suggests that "they" are actually thinking. "They" are not thinking at all ....and that is true on the democrat side just as much.
It's the same old tired Left versus Right false argument, and nowhere is it more well demonstrated than in the healthcare debate. The right wants to keep things as a free market system (which it really never has been) and the left wants to "Fix it" by having it run totally by a defunct government who cannot install a toilet at the pentagon without paying 10 times what it should cost. A government who's track record in healthcare is typified by the disgraceful VA Hospital system, and a corrupt and broken Medicare system that is partially responsible for the skyrocketing healthcare costs that have run 20 times the rate of inflation for the past 20 years. A government that fouls up everything it touches. BRILLIANT IDEA Mr. Democrat! You are the smart ones? Hardly.
What we have here is Dumb (right) and Dumber (left).
It's a false choice between unacceptable and total absurdity. We already see what we can expect from "Government" in the deplorable tack record of the FDA and it's corruption regarding the FAT CATS running big Pharma. Nothing has outpaced the cost increases seen in mainstream medicine over the past two decades, while the state of health in this country has declined. What a combo. So the left's great solution to this is to allow government to control everything? Including forcing people to participate in this gigantic nightmare against their will? Guess what happens when people have no choice? The only choice they have becomes totally intolerable.
Do you think the quality of GM automobiles would improve or decline if the government mandated that everyone must by a Chevy? Without competition and choice, you wind up with the very worst, as opposed to the best. An that's partially the reason why healthcare in this country is now in such a terrible state. We have a system that thrives on treating sickness rather than promoting wellness. Yet we think that's going to deliver good healthcare, and the only debate revolves around "who pays" and "how much".
Freaking idiocy, and not many people have a leg to stand on when they criticize the "other side", and that includes you.
Last edited by GuyNTexas; 03-28-2012 at 09:21 PM..
It's worse that. To say "this is how they think" suggests that "they" are actually thinking. "They" are not thinking at all ....and that is true on the democrat side just as much.
It's the same old tired Left versus Right false argument, and nowhere is it more well demonstrated than in the healthcare debate. The right wants to keep things as a free market system (which it really never has been) and the left wants to "Fix it" by having it run totally by a defunct government who cannot install a toilet at the pentagon without paying 10 times what it should cost. A government who's track record in healthcare is typified by the disgraceful VA Hospital system, and a corrupt and broken Medicare system that is partially responsible for the skyrocketing healthcare costs that have run 20 times the rate of inflation for the past 20 years. A government that fouls up everything it touches. BRILLIANT IDEA Mr. Democrat! You are the smart ones? Hardly.
What we have here is Dumb (right) and Dumber (left).
It's a false choice between unacceptable and total absurdity. We already see what we can expect from "Government" in the deplorable tack record of the FDA and it's corruption regarding the FAT CATS running big Pharma. Nothing has outpaced the cost increases seen in mainstream medicine over the past two decades, while the state of health in this country has declined. What a combo. So the left's great solution to this is to allow government to control everything? Including forcing people to participate in this gigantic nightmare against their will? Guess what happens when people have no choice? The only choice they have becomes totally intolerable.
Do you think the quality of GM automobiles would improve or decline if the government mandated that everyone must by a Chevy? Without competition and choice, you wind up with the very worst, as opposed to the best. An that's partially the reason why healthcare in this country is now in such a terrible state. We have a system that thrives on treating sickness rather than promoting wellness. Yet we think that's going to deliver good healthcare, and the only debate revolves around "who pays" and "how much".
Freaking idiocy, and not many people have a leg to stand on when they criticize the "other side", and that includes you.
This group tends to be male; aged 18-34; High school graduates or some college education (HS dropouts and college grads are more likely to be insured); white; native US born; not married, no kids; and with household incomes of $40-70K. Those with higher and lower incomes tend to be insured or in-voluntarily uninsured.
About 43% of the uninsured are voluntarily so, based on income alone.
This group tends to be male; aged 18-34; High school graduates or some college education (HS dropouts and college grads are more likely to be insured); white; native US born; not married, no kids; and with household incomes of $40-70K. Those with higher and lower incomes tend to be insured or in-voluntarily uninsured.
About 43% of the uninsured are voluntarily so, based on income alone.
Sounds like the demographic who shows up in the ER with broken bones from ATV wrecks, ski trips, or car crashes.
This group tends to be male; aged 18-34; High school graduates or some college education (HS dropouts and college grads are more likely to be insured); white; native US born; not married, no kids; and with household incomes of $40-70K. Those with higher and lower incomes tend to be insured or in-voluntarily uninsured.
About 43% of the uninsured are voluntarily so, based on income alone.
Exactly the sort of guys who think they're invincible, until they learn they aren't.
This group tends to be male; aged 18-34; High school graduates or some college education (HS dropouts and college grads are more likely to be insured); white; native US born; not married, no kids; and with household incomes of $40-70K. Those with higher and lower incomes tend to be insured or in-voluntarily uninsured.
About 43% of the uninsured are voluntarily so, based on income alone.
The very idea that this majority of "uninsured" is the 40-70K income crowd is a preposterous claim, ... since it's a prerequisite for people employed in healthcare industry to embrace absurd claims without questioning. Correction ... after actually reading the link myself .... this is you distorting the study claims ....
But you left out a few things ....
"A disproportionately large percentage of the involuntarily uninsured are young, a third are immigrants, close to half are single without children, and close to 40 percent did not work during the year. Indeed, many of these demographic differences—which are not necessarily shared by the voluntarily uninsured—may contribute to the differences in health coverage."
Of the 47 Million uninsured, you try to suggest that 20 Million of them are white males with plenty of money cannot be found in that document link.
Also ...
"University of New York use data from a number of surveys to determine what percentage of the nearly 47 million uninsured Americans lack health insurance because they are likely unable to afford it—classifying them as “involuntarily” uninsured. They find that at least 43 percent of Americans in the 18–64 year-old age group have incomes at or above 2.5 times the poverty line, indicating they likely have the means to obtain healthcare coverage and thus may be classified as “voluntarily” uninsured."
That's a very broad brush analysis .... and the one thing most knowledgeable people understand is that "statistics" can be manipulated to support any conclusion. Strikingly obvious is the first point ... the study is conducted in New York ... one of the highest cost of living areas in the country .... while the "poverty line" is around $10,000, 2.5 times that figure would be $25,000. Anyone living in New York is not likely to be vacationing in the Hamptons with a $25K income ...that's Burger Flipper income, scraping to just get by with rent, food and transportation costs .... unlikely to have enough extra money to pay for healthcare plans.
Good grief. I find such distortions SHAMELESS.
Last edited by CaseyB; 03-29-2012 at 05:14 AM..
Reason: rude
Sounds like the demographic who shows up in the ER with broken bones from ATV wrecks, ski trips, or car crashes.
No .. it sounds like BS.
What the ER's generally see are a heck of a lot of poor people using it as a doctors office because they cannot be refused. Lots of poor ... lots of illegals ... lots of very questionable characters .... not droves of young white males with 70K incomes. They make up the cost of this free healthcare delivery by charging grandma's Medicare and Blue Cross supplemental 5 times what it should cost. And Grandma doesn't really think about it, as it's all taken care of by the Hospital Billing department, so she doesn't even notice the $200 worth of Tylenol she took in 3 days.
Suffice it to say that the ER's see a lot more gang related gunshot wounds than they do Ski accidents, and Obama gonna fix it by making it worse.
But what do you expect from Washington DC .... the truth? Competence? Honesty? When has that ever been a Washington DC trait?
Employment Policies Institute
1090 Vermont Ave. NW, Suite 800
Washington, D.C. 20005
Last edited by GuyNTexas; 03-28-2012 at 10:36 PM..
The problem is that most want their health insurance to pay for routine, regular treatment, not unexpected, potentially bankrupting emergencies. A plan with a $3000 deductable is quite reasonable. That, in conjunction with a health savings account, to which the employer contributes, is what I have.
If your car insurance company had to pay for your tires, brakes, belts, hoses, etc, you would be hard pressed to afford it too.
Excellent points. I've never thought of it that way, but you're right.
What the ER's generally see are a heck of a lot of poor people using it as a doctors office because they cannot be refused. Lots of poor ... lots of illegals ... lots of very questionable characters.
I dare say the ER's see a lot more gang related gunshot wounds than they do Ski accidents.
But what do you expect from Washington DC .... the truth?
Employment Policies Institute
1090 Vermont Ave. NW, Suite 800
Washington, D.C. 20005
Gunshot victims probably have Medicaid...or SCHIP, or some other coverage...
The big dollars in unreimbursed care are illegals, trauma, neonatal, and cardiac events.
Gunshot victims probably have Medicaid...or SCHIP, or some other coverage...
The big dollars in unreimbursed care are illegals, trauma, neonatal, and cardiac events.
And you have data to support that? No .. you don't. Because, trauma and cardiac events are medical conditions ... not demographics defining insurance status.
Furthermore, Medicaid is not healthcare coverage ... it's welfare/public assistance that you pay for involuntarily now. Medicaid is just a welfare fund designed for tapping into public funds by the healthcare establishment. SCHIP is for Children.
ObamaCare is nothing short of universal application of medicaid that will be paid for by increased costs to those who already have health insurance plans.
What I'd like to know is how people can be convinced that this idiocy will save them money ... since in my half a century of life, I've never actually witnessed an event where the Politicos in DC have ever managed that feat on any matter. 14 Trillion in national debt suggests that they haven't had much success in the "saving us money" department ... but they continue to make such promises. I just can't imagine why anybody would still believe such idiotic nonsense, given such consistent failure to actually do such a thing.
Oh yeah .... Hope and Change.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
