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No, I took into account your posting history, and I think your position is pretty clear.
Don't you own a business? Surely at some point during the startup process you didn't earn a sizable income for the year and your CPA made sure you didn't have to pay any personal FIT, right?
You do also understand that a lot of people who don't pay any PERSONAL federal income tax do pay corporate tax instead? So they actually are paying taxes, just not income tax?
Or do you think people that take the risk putting everything they have and all their effort and ingenuity into a business startup should pay tax twice?
Of course you understand that some of the 47% of Americans that don't pay Federal Income Tax contribute plenty and aren't getting a free ride by any means.
You do understand that once they stop operating at a loss they'll contribute plenty?
You weren't trying to infer that everyone who makes up this 47% are some kind of "recipient class", were you?
Sole propietorships are 100% irrelevant. Corporations are 100% irrelevant. Hell, even the tax code is 100% irrelevant to the discussion. This is about PRINCIPLE. That's what you folks don't get. We can delve into the minutiae of the tax code all day long and talk about who should or shouldn't get what and how it should be revised, but the underlying point is that one segment of society is being singled out while another is not. Did you forget about the word "FAIR?"
You flubbed your understanding of the OP from the outset. If you want to talk about the minutiae of the tax code and how it benefits America businesses or not, then start your own thread. Your points are 100% irrelevant to the OP.
Ummm...in your example you used a taxable income of around $15K with an after tax income of around $5K. How did you forget that considering you used the example of a burger flipper who took the standard deductions?
According to my calculator, that's less than all of the EITC numbers you posted above. Your example is a PRIME candidate for the EITC credit.
$15080 is GROSS income, $5480 is TAXABLE income.
The GROSS income exceeds the maximum allowed to qualify for EITC.
*****Earned Income***** and adjusted gross income (AGI) must each be less than:
$45,060 ($50,270 married filing jointly) with three or more qualifying children
$41,952 ($47,162 married filing jointly) with two qualifying children
$36,920 ($42,130 married filing jointly) with one qualifying child
$13,980 ($19,190 married filing jointly) with no qualifying children
Done with this pointless tit-for-tat. You've proven nothing except that you can pull an example out of your ass that doesn't have any bearing on anything whatsoever. It's almost as if you feel that your example is the holy grail of examples that debunks the OP. Your numbers are arbitrary....your assumptions are arbitrary....your whole example is arbitrary and pointless.
Sole propietorships are 100% irrelevant. Corporations are 100% irrelevant. Hell, even the tax code is 100% irrelevant to the discussion. This is about PRINCIPLE. That's what you folks don't get. We can delve into the minutiae of the tax code all day long and talk about who should or shouldn't get what and how it should be revised, but the underlying point is that one segment of society is being singled out while another is not. Did you forget about the word "FAIR?"
You flubbed your understanding of the OP from the outset. If you want to talk about the minutiae of the tax code and how it benefits America businesses or not, then start your own thread. Your points are 100% irrelevant to the OP.
And the PRINCIPLE is, that not everyone who doesn't pay federal income tax is shirking their responsibility to the country, which is the "fairness" your OP is alluding to.
You can't say that it's FAIR that someone who's putting their heart and soul into starting a company or running a small business and is not paying themselves much of a salary should pay a higher percentage in taxes than a billionaire who spends more money hiding his assets than innumerable people pay in FIT a year.
You cannot possibly discuss the OP without mentioning the tax code. It's the tax code that allows this to happen.
And the PRINCIPLE is, that not everyone who doesn't pay federal income tax is shirking their responsibility to the country, which is the "fairness" your OP is alluding to.
You can't say that it's FAIR that someone who's putting their heart and soul into starting a company or running a small business and is not paying themselves much of a salary should pay a higher percentage in taxes than a billionaire who spends more money hiding his assets than innumerable people pay in FIT a year.
You cannot possibly discuss the OP without mentioning the tax code. It's the tax code that allows this to happen.
Well, for one, the impetus is on you to back up your claims that these mythical "small businesses" are the people who are not paying federal income taxes. You've made this your central point.....although it's irrelevant.....and now i'm going to hold you responsible for your assertions and your assumptions.
Show me that small businesspeople pouring their "heart and soul" into their work are the people that I reference in the OP. You made the claim....and you've pounded it to death.....now I want to see data. Show me that these people exist in the first place, and then show me how they make up large swaths of the 47% as you have repeatedly asserted. Or will you now back down and claim that a relative handful aren't as important to your point as make them out to be?
You jumped down into the weeds to make your point.....now back it up.
Well, for one, the impetus is on you to back up your claims that these mythical "small businesses" are the people who are not paying federal income taxes. You've made this your central point.....although it's irrelevant.....and now i'm going to hold you responsible for your assertions and your assumptions.
Show me that small businesspeople pouring their "heart and soul" into their work are the people that I reference in the OP. You made the claim....and you've pounded it to death.....now I want to see data. Show me that these people exist in the first place, and then show me how they make up large swaths of the 47% as you have repeatedly asserted. Or will you now back down and claim that a relative handful aren't as important to your point as make them out to be?
You jumped down into the weeds to make your point.....now back it up.
If, like the vast majority of self-employed people, you are a sole proprietor (that is, you own your own business), you have to pay estimated taxes if you expect to owe at least $1,000 in federal tax for the year. However, if you didn't have to pay any taxes last year -- for example, because your business didn't make a profit or because you weren't working -- you don't have to pay any estimated tax this year, no matter what you earn. This rule applies only if you were a U.S. citizen or resident for the year and your tax return for the previous year covered the entire 12 months.
According to the Census, there were 15,532,000 Sole Proprietors that filed tax returns in 2008 with receipts totaling less than $25,000.
I don't but I have been paying income taxes on 85% of mine for a very long time. I guess the government does believe it is income.
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