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Old 05-13-2012, 12:35 AM
 
Location: Point Hope Alaska
4,320 posts, read 4,746,556 times
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This makes much more sense!
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Old 05-13-2012, 12:35 AM
 
26,543 posts, read 14,347,548 times
Reputation: 7401
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
That's a complete distortion of the facts.
no, the original birther claim was that it was impossible for "layers" ( actually groups under a single layer ) to be created in a PDF optimization. as we've seen that claim is not true.

one point the CCP never addressed in the fraudulent LFBC claim was the photos that savannah guthrie ( Savannah Guthrie's Photo | Lockerz ) took during the press conference and release of the LFBC. the photos are at a higher resolution than the PDF so we know that the PDF could not be the source for the document guthrie photographed.

for the "fraudulent PDF" claim to be true requires that the WH had an official certified LFBC ready to scan...... but instead made an additional digital one for no reason.
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Old 05-13-2012, 12:40 AM
 
26,543 posts, read 14,347,548 times
Reputation: 7401
Quote:
Originally Posted by SityData View Post
wow!

the "bomford" birth certificate has resurfaced! that's pretty amazing imo. it's an admitted prank.
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Old 05-13-2012, 12:43 AM
 
Location: Point Hope Alaska
4,320 posts, read 4,746,556 times
Reputation: 1146
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrecking ball View Post
no, the original birther claim was that it was impossible for "layers" ( actually groups under a single layer ) to be created in a PDF optimization. as we've seen that claim is not true.

one point the CCP never addressed in the fraudulent LFBC claim was the photos that savannah guthrie ( Savannah Guthrie's Photo | Lockerz ) took during the press conference and release of the LFBC. the photos are at a higher resolution than the PDF so we know that the PDF could not be the source for the document guthrie photographed.

for the "fraudulent PDF" claim to be true requires that the WH had an official certified LFBC ready to scan...... but instead made an additional digital one for no reason.
You have never addressed the many different anomalies that are present that proves this was a forgery.

you keep blaming OTHERS!!

And this has gone on for months - you always point the finger @ the other person(s).

END OF DISCUSSION
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Old 05-13-2012, 01:04 AM
 
26,543 posts, read 14,347,548 times
Reputation: 7401
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
What? Surely you cannot be this dense. This is like saying "how can a bank robber rob a bank when it's against the law".
that's not even close to being a relevant comparison. for starters the US state dept does not allow a 6-10 year old to renounce US citizenship, something that would be required for indonesian citizenship. exactly how could a 6-10 year old renounce US citizenship illegally?

Quote:
Again .. do you realize how ignorant that question is? The question itself cannot even be responded to.
this was sity's claim, that you can "clearly see" on obama's college transcripts that he received scholarships as a foreign student..... then goes on to complain that we've never seen his college transcripts.

Quote:
The rest, I'm not going to bother with.
nor should you. all the questions are directed at sity based on his claims.

Quote:
Here's what we do know ... his school transcripts from Indonesia says he was an Indonesian citizen and a Muslim.
his elementary school registration lists his citizenship as indonesian. it also lists his place of birth as honolulu. at the time obama was ineligible for indonesian citizenship for multiple reasons under indonesian law. also the US state dept does not allow a 6 year old to renounce US citizenship nor can a parent or step-parent.

Quote:
His grandmother claims she witnessed his birth in Kenya.
no she didn't. sarah obama repeatedly stated he was born in hawaii. here is the complete transcript from the interview:

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-co...iptlulu109.pdf

Quote:
The Kenyan government seems to have lost their records of births in Kenya during the times when Obama might have been born there.
link please.

Quote:
The man is definitely using someone else's Social Security number,...
not according to the social security administration.

Quote:
......and his selective service registration records for the military are sealed.
no it's not. what more do you believe exists outside of the card we've already seen and what evidence do you have that they've been sealed?

Quote:
..... and that's because you are apparently incapable of a single rational thought.
nice.
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Old 05-13-2012, 01:07 AM
 
26,543 posts, read 14,347,548 times
Reputation: 7401
Quote:
Originally Posted by SityData View Post
you keep blaming OTHERS!!

And this has gone on for months - you always point the finger @ the other person(s).
who exactly am i blaming?
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Old 05-13-2012, 01:09 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,095 posts, read 25,902,201 times
Reputation: 6128
Quote:
Originally Posted by SityData View Post
END OF DISCUSSION
I have heard this before...
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Old 05-13-2012, 01:36 AM
 
Location: Los Awesome, CA
8,653 posts, read 6,103,503 times
Reputation: 3368
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrecking ball View Post
that's not even close to being a relevant comparison. for starters the US state dept does not allow a 6-10 year old to renounce US citizenship, something that would be required for indonesian citizenship. exactly how could a 6-10 year old renounce US citizenship illegally?



this was sity's claim, that you can "clearly see" on obama's college transcripts that he received scholarships as a foreign student..... then goes on to complain that we've never seen his college transcripts.



nor should you. all the questions are directed at sity based on his claims.



his elementary school registration lists his citizenship as indonesian. it also lists his place of birth as honolulu. at the time obama was ineligible for indonesian citizenship for multiple reasons under indonesian law. also the US state dept does not allow a 6 year old to renounce US citizenship nor can a parent or step-parent.



no she didn't. sarah obama repeatedly stated he was born in hawaii. here is the complete transcript from the interview:

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-co...iptlulu109.pdf



link please.



not according to the social security administration.



no it's not. what more do you believe exists outside of the card we've already seen and what evidence do you have that they've been sealed?



nice.
Birthers don’t let a little thing called facts get in their way…
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Old 05-13-2012, 03:16 AM
 
14,887 posts, read 8,491,491 times
Reputation: 7312
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrecking ball View Post
that's not even close to being a relevant comparison. for starters the US state dept does not allow a 6-10 year old to renounce US citizenship, something that would be required for indonesian citizenship. exactly how could a 6-10 year old renounce US citizenship illegally?

this was sity's claim, that you can "clearly see" on obama's college transcripts that he received scholarships as a foreign student..... then goes on to complain that we've never seen his college transcripts.

nor should you. all the questions are directed at sity based on his claims.

his elementary school registration lists his citizenship as indonesian. it also lists his place of birth as honolulu. at the time obama was ineligible for indonesian citizenship for multiple reasons under indonesian law. also the US state dept does not allow a 6 year old to renounce US citizenship nor can a parent or step-parent.

no she didn't. sarah obama repeatedly stated he was born in hawaii. here is the complete transcript from the interview:

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-co...iptlulu109.pdf

link please.

not according to the social security administration.

no it's not. what more do you believe exists outside of the card we've already seen and what evidence do you have that they've been sealed?

nice.
And all of this is fodder for fools, by the way, so none of the points are actually relevant (even though you're wrong on all counts).

You see ... many people (who possess an ounce of gray matter) have been perplexed about how these clowns could have been so stupid to present a document with so many blatant errors. Many have said that it's as if they wanted everyone to see what a fraud it was. And I think that's exactly the case. They wanted all of the so called "birthers" to get bogged down in endless fighting over the birth certificate, because it's a distraction from the real point, which is not arguable.

That point being that Obama senior was a British subject at the time of Barack's birth, and that fact is not contested at all. That fact automatically makes him NOT a natural born citizen, as to be a NBC, BOTH parents have to be citizens of the United States. That as they say is THAT.

But to go further, the fact that Obama senior was a British subject at the time of Barack's birth made Barack a British subject too ...as the Nationality Act of 1948 states clearly that any offspring born who's father is a British national is also a British national, and therefore, that too makes Obama ineligible because the qualifications state that he must be a Natural Born Citizen owing no allegiance to a foreign power. Being a British subject does entail owing allegiance to the British crown. (They call citizens "subjects" because the Queen believes she OWNS her people, and she most certainly does demand allegiance.)

Now, just to highlight a piece of evidence that shows that Obama knows this to be true ... he was a co-sponsor of the Bill (# ?) affirming John McCain's natural born citizen status, to clarify any questions about his status given that he was born in Panama. The criteria used for the contention that he was indeed a Natural Born Citizen was that BOTH his parents were citizens, temporarily stationed on foreign soil, but because he was born of parents who were both citizens was the criteria to meet.

Now if you are like all of the other liberals that deny this argument ... claiming that the Constitution doesn't directly specify the exact criteria for natural born citizen, ... you're not exactly wrong, you're just not right. That it wasn't specified indicates that it was universally understood what Natural Born Citizen meant at the time of the writing. How would you then know this? By reading ... read the many documents and SCOTUS decisions of that time regarding the matter. Read the framers other writings for the clues to this not-so-secret fact. It just takes a little bit of time to research it ... for those who want to know the truth.

When the constitution was being written, it's safe to assume that the framers, being the diligent and careful fellows they were, must have consulted historical reference material to assist in such a monumental task. And that's very true. Benjamin Franklin made reference to this in a thank you letter written to (can't recall his name at the moment) who sent him copies of the "Law of Nations" to which Franklin stated that the book came at a perfect time and was being used as a valuable resource for the writing of the constitution that was being written that moment. And other references also suggest that the "Law of Nations" was the most important and most utilized of all reference material during the drafting of the constitution.

Why is this important? Guess where the term "Natural Born Citizen" came from? Yes ...the book, "Law of Nations". Guess how the Law of Nations defines "Natural Born Citizen" ? It says, "a person who's PARENTS are citizens of a nation, shall be considered natural born citizen of that nation" (paraphrasing ...may not be the exact wording).

And this, along with other references to the "Law of Nations" and it's significant contributions to the US Constitution can be found in document after document, after document.

Barack Obama IS THEREFORE NOT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN .... his father was a British subject which automatically disqualified him, and the British laws of nationality made him a British subject at birth, which also disqualified him. And it makes no difference whether he was born in Hawaii ... Kenya ... or Obama's gave birth to him on the freaking White House lawn. The obviously forged birth certificate included all of the obvious errors on purpose. Pure smoke and mirrors to divert attention away from the KNOWN FACTS which disqualify him .. and keep people arguing about side issues that are really irrelevant to the question.
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Old 05-13-2012, 08:10 AM
 
26,543 posts, read 14,347,548 times
Reputation: 7401
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
And all of this is fodder for fools, by the way, so none of the points are actually relevant
they were precisely relevant to the point they were addressing.

Quote:
(even though you're wrong on all counts).
unfreaking believable.

here's how i'm "wrong" on a 6 year old renouncing US citizenship:

"F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN

Parents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship."

Renunciation of U.S. Citizenship

here's how i'm "wrong" about obama not meeting requirements for indonesian citizenship:

"
- being the age of 18 years or older, or being married
- when applying, having resided in Indonesian for a minimum of 5 consecutive years or 10 non consecutive years
- physically and mentally healthy
- can speak the Indonesian language and acknowledge Pancasila and Undang-Undang Dasar Negara Republik Indonesia Tahun 1945
- never convicted of a crime for which the punishment is imprisonment for one year or more
- if having Indonesian citizenship will not give the person dual citizenship
- employed or have fixed income
- pay the citizenship fee

"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indonesian_nationality_law

i'd point out how i'm "wrong" about sarah obama saying the POTUS was born in hawaii by linking to the complete transcript of her interview........... but i already did.

Quote:
That point being that Obama senior was a British subject at the time of Barack's birth, and that fact is not contested at all. That fact automatically makes him NOT a natural born citizen, as to be a NBC, BOTH parents have to be citizens of the United States. That as they say is THAT.
wrong

"Based upon the language of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 and the guidance provided by Wong Kim Ark, we conclude that persons born within the borders of the United States are "natural born Citizens" for Article II, Section 1 purposes, regardless of the citizenship of their parents."

- ankeny v daniels

" Therefore every person born within the United States, its territories or districts, whether the parents are citizens or aliens, is a natural born citizen in the sense of the constitution, and entitled to all the rights and privileges."

- william rawle, 1825

A View of the Constitution of the United States of America - William Rawle - Google Books

Quote:
...as the Nationality Act of 1948 states clearly that any offspring born who's father is a British national is also a British national,...
that's the BRITISH nationality act of 1948. british law, not US. we are a sovereign nation and are not shackled by the whims of other countries citizenship laws. all countries are free to decide to whom and how they bestow their citizenship.

Quote:
.... because the qualifications state that he must be a Natural Born Citizen owing no allegiance to a foreign power.
nowhere is this definition of NBC stated. if you can find it i'm sure michelle bachmann would be interested in reading it.

Quote:
Now, just to highlight a piece of evidence that shows that Obama knows this to be true ... he was a co-sponsor of the Bill (# ?) affirming John McCain's natural born citizen status, to clarify any questions about his status given that he was born in Panama. The criteria used for the contention that he was indeed a Natural Born Citizen was that BOTH his parents were citizens,.....
the senate resolution never made an exclusive requirement that both parents be US citizens. here is what it does say ( from the tribe/olson memo, the only piece of evidence attached to the resolution ):

" These sources all confirm that the phrase “natural born” includes both birth abroad to parents who were citizens, and birth within a nation’s territory and allegiance."

The Tribe/Olson 'Natural Born Citizen' Memo

Quote:
Guess where the term "Natural Born Citizen" came from? Yes ...the book, "Law of Nations". Guess how the Law of Nations defines "Natural Born Citizen" ? It says, "a person who's PARENTS are citizens of a nation, shall be considered natural born citizen of that nation" (paraphrasing ...may not be the exact wording).
de vattel's books never mentioned NBC, not in the original french or the english translation.

here is the original french quote:

"Les Naturels ou indigènes font ceux qui font nés dans le pays de Parens Citoyens."

nothing in that translates to "natural born citizen".

this was the english translation available at the time of the formation of the US constitution ( 1760 and 1787 editions ):

" The natives, or indigenes, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens "

it wasn't until 1797, 10 years after the ratification of the constitution and long after vattel's death, that an edition was published with NBC.

De Vattel: revisited | Obama Conspiracy Theories
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