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Old 10-06-2012, 09:07 AM
 
4,743 posts, read 3,721,894 times
Reputation: 2481

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJJersey View Post
There is some correlational evidence to suggest that vaccination is related to autism, and other evidence suggests that the two are unrelated. Cultures that don't believe in vaccination have very low rates of autism, despite living in a geographical area with high autism rates (ie. Amish Communities), and the onset of childhood autism usually follows a series of vaccinations. However, when a province in Japan banned the MMR vaccine for ten years, the autism rate rose at the same amount as surrounding areas. I think that vaccines can cause ASD in some genetically susceptible children, but probably aren't the cause for the large increase in autism.
Now that is plain and total BS. Any culture without vaccination is a culture of low healthcare and lack of diagnostic ability. And the only people who would seek medical care for Autusim would be those rich enough to to get the vacinnees.

 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:16 AM
 
4,743 posts, read 3,721,894 times
Reputation: 2481
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
Katiana,I guess you had to look long and hard to find one that said what you were hoping they would.....autism is extremely rare in the amish, seems if they bring a child in for a broken limb, or some other problem, THAT is when the hospitals take it upon themselves to vaccinate them to the hilt, and thus, unfortunately , some of these unlucky ones do regress into autism....autism probably has been around for hundreds of years, but it was very rare, not like now where almost 1 in 50 boys and 1-150 girls become autistic after recieving vaccines.........Vaccination Causes Autism

That is quite the absurdity. I mean really the Amish? How many Amish get their annual medical check-up? Anyone who doesn't get the vacinne is likely NOT to get healthcare. Thus its a bit like putting the chicken before the egg (or vice versa)


And anyone who researches the matter will note that a lot of the increase in Autism is due to - gasp - better understanding of symptoms and diagnosis. Diagnosing more people doesn't mean your rate is rising.


1) Autism symptoms can be found in Austic children prior to vaccination
2) The removal of Theirmosol from Vaccine had no impact to Autism rates
3) Vaccine are given at times that are correlated with Autisim being easier to diagnose, but Vaccine schedules are pretty consistent. Happy coincidence . . .Correlation does not equal CAUSATION.

4) there is no grand conspiracy against you, Vacinne haters. Pharma companies barley make any money on the crap anyway (when is the last time you saw a vacinne commercial. ALl money is on Erectile dysfunction and depression)

NeuroLogica Blog » Early Diagnosis of Autism – Implications for the Vaccine Hypothesis


To summarize, the vaccine-autism hypothesis has the virtue of being a scientific hypothesis in that it is amenable to falsification. It has now been falsified by multiple independent lines of evidence:epidemiological, genetic, and now clinical. Clinging to a failed hypothesis far beyond the point of falsification is a hallmark of pseudoscience and ideology, and clearly that is what we are dealing with here.
 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:21 AM
 
12,890 posts, read 15,383,757 times
Reputation: 14833
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunnysee View Post
Good Grief! Polio oral Vaccine is in the news and it's bad, very bad.


In 2011, there were an extra 47,500 new cases of non-polio acute


Sadly, watch the supporters of the shots get to work to try and negate the truth about this subject, and how we that rejected immunizations for our children are, and will be proven full of wisdom for many years, to come.
You're right Sunnysee, I'm reminded of a quote (I can't remember the author) that says: All truth passes through 3 stages....first it is ridiculed.....second it is violently opposed, and third it is accepted as being self evident.....................I see exactly this happening...it's very sad indeed.
 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:32 AM
 
12,890 posts, read 15,383,757 times
Reputation: 14833
Why Don’t the Amish Have Autistic Children?
 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:34 AM
 
4,743 posts, read 3,721,894 times
Reputation: 2481
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
You're right Sunnysee, I'm reminded of a quote (I can't remember the author) that says: All truth passes through 3 stages....first it is ridiculed.....second it is violently opposed, and third it is accepted as being self evident.....................I see exactly this happening...it's very sad indeed.

You see that happening? spreading rumors dispelled for over 20 years and somehow acceptance and vindication is just around the corner?


You know what that is called?

Idealology, fantacisim, religion, not science.


Being proven true (Christ will come back, The one world order will emerge, etc) is always just around the corner. . .just a little longer


We will all be long in the grave, and this pseduo belief/science vindication will still just . . .be . . .around. . .the . . corner
 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:37 AM
 
4,743 posts, read 3,721,894 times
Reputation: 2481
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
Heh. You know what confirmation bias is. ONly believing the studies who confirm your world view, and ignoring real science

The Amish Myth has already been discredited. Move on.


The question of autism amongst the Amish has been studied and is being presented at the IMFAR autism conference this week. The paper, Prevalence Rates of Autism Spectrum Disorders Among the Old Order Amish, demonstrates a preliminary prevalence of 1 in 271 as the prevalence of autism amongst Amish children in two Amish communities: Holmes County, Ohio and Elkhart-Lagrange County, Indiana. - https://imfar.confex.com/imfar/2010/...Paper7336.html
 
Old 10-06-2012, 09:55 AM
 
12,890 posts, read 15,383,757 times
Reputation: 14833
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisFromChicago View Post
That is quite the absurdity. I mean really the Amish? How many Amish get their annual medical check-up? Anyone who doesn't get the vacinne is likely NOT to get healthcare. Thus its a bit like putting the chicken before the egg (or vice versa)


And anyone who researches the matter will note that a lot of the increase in Autism is due to - gasp - better understanding of symptoms and diagnosis. Diagnosing more people doesn't mean your rate is rising.


1) Autism symptoms can be found in Austic children prior to vaccination
2) The removal of Theirmosol from Vaccine had no impact to Autism rates
3) Vaccine are given at times that are correlated with Autisim being easier to diagnose, but Vaccine schedules are pretty consistent. Happy coincidence . . .Correlation does not equal CAUSATION.

4) there is no grand conspiracy against you, Vacinne haters. Pharma companies barley make any money on the crap anyway (when is the last time you saw a vacinne commercial. ALl money is on Erectile dysfunction and depression)

NeuroLogica Blog » Early Diagnosis of Autism – Implications for the Vaccine Hypothesis


To summarize, the vaccine-autism hypothesis has the virtue of being a scientific hypothesis in that it is amenable to falsification. It has now been falsified by multiple independent lines of evidence:epidemiological, genetic, and now clinical. Clinging to a failed hypothesis far beyond the point of falsification is a hallmark of pseudoscience and ideology, and clearly that is what we are dealing with here.
How many get their annual physical checkup?..few, if any, you really ought to do of this research you keep telling everyone else to do....better diagnosing as an excuse for alarming rises in autism is indeed an absurdity.... explain how anyone could possibly know that when most newborns are now vaccinated almost immediately after birth with the dangerous, damaging, totally unnecessary hep b vaccine....the removal of mercury (there are still trace amounts by the way, and they do add up) is something people like you just love to bring up as "proof" that with the still rising rates of autism it can't be blamed....is that all you think is toxic in a vaccine?...do you not understand that it's continually adding more and more vaccines to the infant schedule, and all these other toxins that are just as harmful?....how rediculous is it when if you've ever bothered to look at a vaccine insert (something most young trusting mothers are never given the oppurtunity to do) you would see the list of contraindications...allergy, certain illnesse etc.....do you ask your newborn baby if he/she is allergic to any of the additives?...and does your baby answer?....You say correlation does not equal causation ( a favorite amoungst vaccine proponants), that's your perogative, personally the many graphs that show a direct correlation between rising infant vaccine schedules with rising autism rates is all I need to err on the side of caution...my child will NOT be a guinea pig for big pharma....Pharma doesn't make big money, you're right, they make HUGE money, I'm talking billions on one vaccine alone....they don't need to advertise, they just need to tack another vaccine on our infants schedule, and our poor children will pay for it.
 
Old 10-06-2012, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Northern CA
12,770 posts, read 9,818,553 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisFromChicago View Post
Heh. You know what confirmation bias is. ONly believing the studies who confirm your world view, and ignoring real science

The Amish Myth has already been discredited. Move on.


The question of autism amongst the Amish has been studied and is being presented at the IMFAR autism conference this week. The paper, Prevalence Rates of Autism Spectrum Disorders Among the Old Order Amish, demonstrates a preliminary prevalence of 1 in 271 as the prevalence of autism amongst Amish children in two Amish communities: Holmes County, Ohio and Elkhart-Lagrange County, Indiana. - https://imfar.confex.com/imfar/2010/...Paper7336.html
Your study of 1899 children, shows only 14 testing positive in both screenings. That's extremely low, supporting the observation that autism is rare in the unvaccinated Amish community. You haven't debunked anything.
 
Old 10-06-2012, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
23,336 posts, read 28,138,757 times
Reputation: 28814
Quote:
Originally Posted by CDusr View Post
This is not false. The immune system evolves. There are many different areas. One being the digestive system.

You do not die because your immune system doesn't function as well as someone else. You are likely to have problems, however. So you think a baby has the same immune system as a healthy adult?

If babies and infants had immune systems as good as healthy adults why is their such an issue with protecting them, because they are more at risk? Do you understand how you are contradicting established understanding?

The money is enormous. How in the world can you say that? A company protected from liability of massive global production? No one should be immune from liability of a product they produce. Glaxo and Merck do quite well. Please.

The true uninformed consent comes from people not asking questions and not reading those enclosed information sheets. Many people never read those sheets.
We protect babies from infections because we do not want them to get sick. They are just as capable of responding to vaccines as they are of responding to natural infections. The difference is that the natural infections can make them very sick, with a much greater risk of permanent damage or death.

If money is the object, the companies would just stop making vaccines. Then they could make more money on antibiotics and other medications than they would ever make on vaccines. It is much more lucrative to treat disease than to prevent it. The vaccine compensation fund allows people who truly have had serious vaccine reactions to be compensated, without having to even sue anyone. It prevents billions of dollars from being spent on frivolous suits by people who have not been injured by vaccines.

If someone is not informed because he chooses not to be, then whose fault is that?
 
Old 10-06-2012, 10:14 AM
 
4,743 posts, read 3,721,894 times
Reputation: 2481
Your child seems to suffer from a incurable disease, a illogical and conspiracy thinking parent. A parent who put ideology before reason. It is a disease that could very well kill the child, and others, without the protection so many take for granted.

I have posted studies from actual accredited (and not self delluding websites) regarding the Amish myth. A myth that was tested, and found untrue. Amish do get autisim, sad to say. . . perhaps they aren't often diagnosed. . .but someone did the research. Went out and studied the kids, and followed the diagnostic criteria.

Big Pharma doesn't care about vacinnes. There is no money to make there. There is no secret incentive. Look at the top companies, and their revenue makers and you won't find these vacinees. 99% of the time its little outfits making these vacinees. . .that are almost always generic.

Big Pharma is abandoning vacinnes, they have been abandoning it for sometime. NO money to be made, not when compared to Cancer, Depression, Erectile dysfunction. In your dream world its some big business, and some grand conspiracy for billions upon billions of dollars.



20-30% of Hep B cases are contracted during early childhood. Liver, cancer, and death are the outcomes.

and one last thing

"You say correlation does not equal causation ( a favorite amoungst vaccine proponants),"

Is it so wrong to think? This is not a favorite amount vaccine proponents, this is a favorite among critical thinking. If you learn about research, quantitative studies you will learn about these things and why you should avoid falling into the traps. Parade of Horribles for instance.

Correlation does not equal causation is a motto we should all live by.





Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
How many get their annual physical checkup?..few, if any, you really ought to do of this research you keep telling everyone else to do....better diagnosing as an excuse for alarming rises in autism is indeed an absurdity.... explain how anyone could possibly know that when most newborns are now vaccinated almost immediately after birth with the dangerous, damaging, totally unnecessary hep b vaccine....the removal of mercury (there are still trace amounts by the way, and they do add up) is something people like you just love to bring up as "proof" that with the still rising rates of autism it can't be blamed....is that all you think is toxic in a vaccine?...do you not understand that it's continually adding more and more vaccines to the infant schedule, and all these other toxins that are just as harmful?....how rediculous is it when if you've ever bothered to look at a vaccine insert (something most young trusting mothers are never given the oppurtunity to do) you would see the list of contraindications...allergy, certain illnesse etc.....do you ask your newborn baby if he/she is allergic to any of the additives?...and does your baby answer?....You say correlation does not equal causation ( a favorite amoungst vaccine proponants), that's your perogative, personally the many graphs that show a direct correlation between rising infant vaccine schedules with rising autism rates is all I need to err on the side of caution...my child will NOT be a guinea pig for big pharma....Pharma doesn't make big money, you're right, they make HUGE money, I'm talking billions on one vaccine alone....they don't need to advertise, they just need to tack another vaccine on our infants schedule, and our poor children will pay for it.
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