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Old 06-10-2012, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Southcentral Kansas
44,882 posts, read 33,209,134 times
Reputation: 4269

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
If someone has proposed the complete elimination of the use of fossil fuels in our lifetime it`s news to me.
Cap and Trade was just what you missed out on, I think.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:31 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,880 posts, read 15,169,069 times
Reputation: 5239
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
So do I. I set out to buy a truck but I do not need to be able to pull a building or want to put gas in at 17 mpg.

I'll get a trailer for my car.

I get 21 city and 27 highway on my duramax deisel.
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Old 06-11-2012, 07:21 AM
 
6,734 posts, read 9,325,964 times
Reputation: 1857
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marv101 View Post
The Volt's price tag simply precludes it ever becoming an everyday commuter car, and I do agree that the subsidies/rebates/bribes/are pointless.
It's not a car for people on a budget. It's a car for people who want to reduce their carbon footprint and can afford to do so. Nobody said it would be cheap to do reduce fossil fuel consumption.
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Old 06-11-2012, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,400,833 times
Reputation: 6541
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzie679 View Post
It's not a car for people on a budget. It's a car for people who want to reduce their carbon footprint and can afford to do so. Nobody said it would be cheap to do reduce fossil fuel consumption.
Yet it is a car that increases their carbon footprint, significantly.

Electric vehicles produce more pollution than a gasoline combustion engine. Where do you think that electricity comes from? Coal, oil, or natural gas power plants. Furthermore, what do you think will happen to all those lithium-ion batteries after they are used up and cannot be recharged any further after between 5 and 7 years?
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:02 AM
 
6,734 posts, read 9,325,964 times
Reputation: 1857
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
Yet it is a car that increases their carbon footprint, significantly.

Electric vehicles produce more pollution than a gasoline combustion engine. Where do you think that electricity comes from? Coal, oil, or natural gas power plants. Furthermore, what do you think will happen to all those lithium-ion batteries after they are used up and cannot be recharged any further after between 5 and 7 years?
Yes, but it depends on the region. But it's not a significant increase in carbon emissions. In some regions a hybrid produces less carbon emissions and in others the electric vehicle has the advantage.

But it's a fact that nationally, on average, the electric car produces a less carbon emissions than the hybrid or non-hybrid gasoline vehicle.

I'm not a grennie by any means. I'm just saying that nobody said that "eco-friendly" technology was going to be cheap.
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:37 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,741,143 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
Yet it is a car that increases their carbon footprint, significantly.

Electric vehicles produce more pollution than a gasoline combustion engine. Where do you think that electricity comes from? Coal, oil, or natural gas power plants. Furthermore, what do you think will happen to all those lithium-ion batteries after they are used up and cannot be recharged any further after between 5 and 7 years?
the batteries are 100% recyclable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzie679 View Post
Yes, but it depends on the region. But it's not a significant increase in carbon emissions. In some regions a hybrid produces less carbon emissions and in others the electric vehicle has the advantage.

But it's a fact that nationally, on average, the electric car produces a less carbon emissions than the hybrid or non-hybrid gasoline vehicle.

I'm not a grennie by any means. I'm just saying that nobody said that "eco-friendly" technology was going to be cheap.
actually the carbon footprint of the volt, and cars like it such as the prius, do more environmental damage than an H2 hummer does when you take everything into account, including mining the raw materials.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:52 AM
 
14,941 posts, read 8,552,410 times
Reputation: 7360
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
We`ll be switching to paying for the roads by miles driven not gasoline purchased so there`s one silly theory out the window.
Besides the obvious differences between "what we will be doing one day" and what we have been "actually doing all along" .... one has absolutely nothing to do with the other ... which is why silly people shouldn't call anyone else's ideas silly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
The reason we`re so far behind in fuel efficiency is because Reagan gutted and rolled back Carter`s energy program and those electric cars can be powered with wind,solar or hydro if we have the will. 3 strikes means you`re out
Talk about silly ... longing for the days of "Jimmy Carter" goes way beyond silly from a multitude of angles, PARTICULARLY regarding energy policy, and the reality of what alternative energy advocates propose today.

First, he called for massive increases in "windfall profit taxation" to pay for an aggressive and costly shift away from oil fired power generation in order to reduce US dependence on foreign oil imports ... shifting to MORE COAL fired power plants ... the "dirtiest" form of power according to the green-heads today. So not only would that have been counterproductive in and of itself, it would have also added the negative economic impact that ALWAYS results from large tax increases, at the very time when the nation was in the throws of an economic crisis and out of control high inflation already.

This is what we can always depend on from leftist democrats ... it's their answer for everything ... more taxes to pay for idiotic ideas .... be it Jimmy Carter, Al Gore, or our new Nanny-N-Chief ... big momma Obama.

Silly doesn't begin to describe it.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:36 AM
 
14,941 posts, read 8,552,410 times
Reputation: 7360
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
the batteries are 100% recyclable.

actually the carbon footprint of the volt, and cars like it such as the prius, do more environmental damage than an H2 hummer does when you take everything into account, including mining the raw materials.
This is another example of how people are deceived by the lying liars and their bogus statistical figuring, particularly those associated with the EPA and their development of standards and ratings.

For example, when calculating the environmental impact of the Toyota Prius, they used hydro-electric power as the source .... set a 55 mph limit on the vehicle at an acceleration rate of 3.3 mph per second. That acceleration rate equates to a full 18 seconds, 0-60 mph .... which may have been reasonable if we were talking about the good old days of the Ford Model T, but not so much here in the 21st Century of 70 mph speed limits and cars that average 0-60 in less than half of that 18 seconds.

Yet, this was the criteria used to show that a gasoline vehicle would need to get 60 mpg in order to equal the Prius for environmental impact, without even considering the impact of mining the raw materials used for the %^% batteries that need to be replaced every 3 years on an electric car.

It's mind numbing.
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Old 06-12-2012, 12:25 PM
 
29,409 posts, read 21,965,989 times
Reputation: 5455
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
the batteries are 100% recyclable.



actually the carbon footprint of the volt, and cars like it such as the prius, do more environmental damage than an H2 hummer does when you take everything into account, including mining the raw materials.
Yes but how much will that end up costing the taxpayers in the long run? As this article states many problems will arise from these batteries and recycling them, problem which none have even thought about when the quest for "green" took over.

"In the United States, the Department of Energy has granted $9.5 million to Toxco to build a specialized recycling plant in Ohio for electric vehicle batteries. It is expected to begin operations next year, handling batteries from a variety of makes and models."

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/31/bu...pagewanted=all
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Old 06-12-2012, 12:32 PM
 
8,594 posts, read 9,093,828 times
Reputation: 5930
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzie679 View Post
It's not a car for people on a budget. It's a car for people who want to reduce their carbon footprint and can afford to do so. Nobody said it would be cheap to do reduce fossil fuel consumption.
I purchased a cadillac deville for just a few thousand dollars more than a volt. I was at the chevy dealer the other day and was amazed at the sticker price of the volt, 42,000 dollars for that boat anchor. One ugly footprint.
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