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Old 06-17-2012, 05:25 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,896,272 times
Reputation: 5661

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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
What about the working poor? Should burger flippers and janitors be taxed higher also? I once worked two jobs to pay the rent so that my landlord could work zero jobs. Should he be taxed higher or lower?
Conservatives can't make up their mind. One argument for Bush's tax-cuts that lowered rates on low incomes was to encourage the working poor to work -- the theory being that taxes discourage work. Now, they're all crowing about poor people not having "skin in the game."

The bottom line is conservative arguments all have agendas.
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Old 06-17-2012, 06:23 AM
 
58,637 posts, read 26,934,714 times
Reputation: 14137
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Conservatives can't make up their mind. One argument for Bush's tax-cuts that lowered rates on low incomes was to encourage the working poor to work -- the theory being that taxes discourage work. Now, they're all crowing about poor people not having "skin in the game."

The bottom line is conservative arguments all have agendas.
At least conservatives have a mind to make up.

Look at your own post here.

Bush LOWERED taxes. Notice it does NOT say ELIMINATE as you try to make one the same as the other.

Hint, there is a difference.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 17,299,429 times
Reputation: 7990
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
If you look at your own source, revenue fell from 2001 to 2004. In inflation adjusted terms, it took the height of the housing bubble, 2006, to reach 2001 income. That is ordinarily astounding, considering that the population grew during those years....
Historical Federal Receipt and Outlay Summary

Well if you look again at your own look at my source, it provides inflation adjusted numbers (constant 2005 dollars, 4th column from left).

Total federal receipts from 2000 to 2008, inflation adjusted, looked like this:

2000...2.3 trillion dollars
2001...2.2
2002...2.0
2003...1.9
2004...1.9
2005...2.1
2006...2.3
2007...2.4
2008...2.3

The dot.com bust happened in early 2000, and then there was the 9/11 attack in 2001, neither of which helped federal revenue growth. If you factor in population growth, it makes a little difference but not nearly enough to make your case.

Bottom line, as I stated before, total fed revenue was fairly flat during the Bush years. If you want to explain why deficits exploded, look at the spending side, not the 'Bush tax cuts.'
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,288 posts, read 20,657,476 times
Reputation: 9324
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
Economist Mark J Perry found this interesting factoid. According to 2009 IRS data, the 400 top taxpayers in 2009 shelled out $16.1 billion, while the bottom 50% of taxpayers totaled $19.5 billion in taxes, or less than 25% more.

But, but, but, Obama says they need to pay more..... surely he is correct... surely they could pay another 16 billion and still have enough left over to eat.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:44 AM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,710,797 times
Reputation: 10789
Those of you who defend these exorbitantly wealthy, what do you expect to gain from it? How has that "trickle down economics" or "job creation" going for you?
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,288 posts, read 20,657,476 times
Reputation: 9324
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
Historical Federal Receipt and Outlay Summary

Well if you look again at your own look at my source, it provides inflation adjusted numbers (constant 2005 dollars, 4th column from left).

Total federal receipts from 2000 to 2008, inflation adjusted, looked like this:

2000...2.3 trillion dollars
2001...2.2
2002...2.0
2003...1.9
2004...1.9
2005...2.1
2006...2.3
2007...2.4
2008...2.3

The dot.com bust happened in early 2000, and then there was the 9/11 attack in 2001, neither of which helped federal revenue growth. If you factor in population growth, it makes a little difference but not nearly enough to make your case.

Bottom line, as I stated before, total fed revenue was fairly flat during the Bush years. If you want to explain why deficits exploded, look at the spending side, not the 'Bush tax cuts.'

Be careful. Don't confuse the Krugman lemmings with the facts.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,288 posts, read 20,657,476 times
Reputation: 9324
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Those of you who defend these exorbitantly wealthy, what do you expect to gain from it? How has that "trickle down economics" or "job creation" going for you?

Quite well, thank you for asking.

So how is that "trickle up poverty" working for you?
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:50 AM
 
Location: Midwest
38,496 posts, read 25,710,797 times
Reputation: 10789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Quite well, thank you for asking.

So how is that "trickle up poverty" working for you?
Then you must be very happy with Obama and the economy.

BTW, It isn't trickle up poverty, it is siphoning of America's wealth by the wealthy.
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:56 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,230,301 times
Reputation: 27718
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Those of you who defend these exorbitantly wealthy, what do you expect to gain from it? How has that "trickle down economics" or "job creation" going for you?
No one but this administration said those rich were going to "create jobs".
And "this administration" includes those GOP in Congress.

The government cannot force anyone to create jobs. The government can only create government jobs.

Demand creates jobs in the private sector. If there is no demand then there is no need for more jobs than what there is today.

If anything, demand is down, including global demand, and there are job layoffs happening.

Wake up and stop sitting around waiting for someone to "create a job" for you.

Tax cuts enable people to SPEND money. That was the purpose of the Bush cuts..put more money in peoples pockets to spend.
How this turned around to become "create jobs" was manufactured by this administration.
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Old 06-17-2012, 08:16 AM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,371,043 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by claudiusmaior View Post
As many who have studied statistics or are into math know, what Mr. Levin says is meaningless because we don't have all the terms of the equation. We don't know what the total earnings are of the top earners. We don't know what percentage of their income they paid in taxes. We don't know what is meant by "taxes". Are deductions for paid foreign taxes included in the federal taxes? Are state, local, property and payroll taxes included? We also have no information on the bottom 50%, who they are, what their income is, what percentage of their income they paid in taxes: federal, state, local, school, property, payroll.

Mark Levin is intellectually disingenuous, in my opinion. You can make statistics say anything you want them to say when you don't give complete information.
You're expected to do some modicum of your own research like for example:

SOI-Tax Stats-Top 400 Individual Income Tax Returns with the Largest Adjusted Gross Incomes
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