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I agree with most of your points but my question to you is....what are you doing about it?
We can create threads all day long lamenting the societal drag of the Black lower class, but what are you doing as an individual to change things?
It is really easy for us (the Black middle/upper class) to sit in our nice homes and drive our nice cars to our nice jobs to wag fingers at the lower classes and say "Why don't they blah blah blah...." but I would be disingenuous if I didn't acknowledge that I had advantages in life that are not given to those on the lower rungs. Permanently changing the blight of lower class Blacks is not about throwing more money or more programs at them, it will be done by changing the overall mentality. Sadly, this is going to be the most difficult aspect because each generation grows more entrenched into the counterproductive mentality and it is reinforced by pop culture and normalized.
I appreciate your comment, but I'd like to respond by making the following points:
1) I was not born middle class or given any advantage because of my socio-economic status. To the contrary, I was raised in a lower income neighborhood and my family moved to a working class inner -city neighborhood in my early teen years.
2) My parents were not college educated (at that time one could obtain a decent job out of high school and actual work experience was considered as valuable as a college degree in certain fields). Nonetheless, my parents instilled in me the value of a "quality" education - and they taught me that it was my responsibility to always do my best and to get the most out of my educational experiences. Yes, I was surrounded by other knuckleheads who did not apply themselves or take serious their education. However, my parents did not allow me to falter in school and held me accountable because they wanted the best for me.
3) My parents taught me to respect the law. They said, "You break the law, you go to jail...period. Yes, times are rough out here for black families. And yes, the criminal justice system seems to target young blacks more harshly than other demographics. Even more reason why you better stay your behind off the street corners. Don't give them a reason to target you."
4) I was not the recipient of any quota program during my collegiate or post-graduate studies. I earned my grades (whether good or bad) and I earned the scores I received on my entrance exams, college exams, LSAT, etc. I'm not saying this for any special recognition...heck, that's the way it should be. Moreover, I had to pay my own way through school (in addition to loans) and it took me nearly six years to graduate from undergraduate school.
5) I have encountered racism in many forms from white people at every level of my educational and professional life. I understand that it's very real and is something that impacts America and the black community to some extent.
6) I have "given back" to the black community and tried to draw from my experiences to encourage and inspire young people and adults that success is attainable and should be expected. I've participated in the Upward Bound Program, the Strive Towards Excellence Program, and other similar programs. These programs are helpful, and even essential in some cases...but I've found that there is NO SUBSTITUTE FOR PARENTING.
7) I have also come to conclude that a good portion of the black community does not want to hear anything critical as it applies to them. You asked "what am I doing about it?" Sometimes, it's not about what others can do for you, it's about what you can do for yourself. I think the best thing that I can say to young black kids is to take responsbility for your actions, your education, and your future...because it's yours. Don't make excuses. Don't blame other black people who left the hood. Don't blame the white man. In my experience, however, such messages are often met with resistance or outright hostility.
I also agree with the OP, that one shouldn't commit crimes so they will not be a felon, BUT I don't see comitting a felon in and of itself worth of being disenfranchised. I also dont' see it as a black thing since black people are not the only people who get felonies in this country.
Those who have been convicted of felonies and who served in prison, I do feel belong under those who are protected by the 15 Amendment and as such I view the disenfranchisement of this portion of the population as unconstitutional.
I also feel that disenfranchising and denying financial aid to young people who have a felony in their record on contributes to them furthering their criminal pursuits. Just because someone commits a crime does not mean they are no longer a citizen of this country and insomuch they are citizens I feel they should not be denied the right to vote.
In regards to the voter ID laws, I have no problem with them in theory but in practice I feel they are useless and are just a way to waste money since studies show that voter fraud occurs in less than 1% of all elections. Also I don't think black people are the primary focus in regards to these laws and feel like other posters mentioned that the elderly are more likely to be affected by this. Many states also now have free IDs and they even have to provide people a ride to the ID making location and I see this as a waste of money and ridiculous and so I do not support the voter ID laws. We have them in the state I live in and just thinking about the waste of money makes me upset.
And FWIW, I am black but am not a democrat and I consider myself fiscally conservative, which is why I don't agree with the voter ID laws and a true fiscal conservative IMO shouldn't support them either since they are a waste of money.
If you stop to read, you'll notice that I said "black people on this forum." That should clear up any constipation you have.
That is like me saying many of the whites on this forum think minorities are the biggest problem in America today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nighttrain55
if you got a problem with the black community, here is some advice, move to canada. They have about 10 black people and they play for the raptors.
I hope this post is suppossed to be a joke. Canada has over 783,000 black people. The city of Toronto has a very large Caribbean population as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin96
As I am typing this post, I am well aware that I will probably get blasted for what I am going to say. I don't care. The following thoughts result from years of frustration over the deterioration that I have observed within the "Black community." As a black man, I don't consider myself overly preoccupied with racial matters - however, I am as are most Americans, race conscious to some extent or another. So, please allow me to explain the reason for my rant today...
Earlier this week I was listening to a segment on NPR covering the topic of whether recent legislation passed or proposed in several states amounted to a concerted effort designed to disenfranchise black voters. Specifically, the opponents pointed to laws that placed voting restrictions on convicted felons as well as laws requiring photo identification when casting a ballot, claiming that such laws unfairly target black voters. The rationale is steeped in the unfortunate reality that an alarming proportion of the black population consists of felons and the contention that some blacks are simply too poor to afford a valid picture ID.
Let's assume for the purpose of this discussion that the aforementioned laws are in fact racially motivated. My response is...so what if they are? Liberals and black race-baiters (we know who they are) would rather direct their anger and frustration at these so-called racist laws in lieu of addressing the underlying issues that cause these laws to adversely impact the black community in a disproportionate manner.
The message should not be "change these laws because felons are more often black." Rather, the message should be to black people "stop commiting felonies!" If you betray the trust of your community and cannot respect the laws/standards put in place by your government, then you relinquish your right to influence the law and government by voting. Seems reasonable to me. Please spare me the excuses as to why the hoodlum decided to rob the liquor store, break in someone's home, steal the car, assault someone, or sell poisonous drugs to children in his community. Yes, there are institutional mechanisms in place that make life a bit more challenging in urban communities. But the cold fact is that it doesn't excuse violent and other criminal behavior. It is past time that the black community stop making excuses for its plight and be accountable. From my perspective, the black community is its own worst enemy and has caused itself much more harm than any laws or institutional mechanism
As for the picture ID requirement, the opponents claims that this amounts to a poll tax because picture IDs cost money (typically a nominal fee). If it is a tax, then it's a tax that all people in that state would have to pay...not just blacks. C'mon people, we need valid identification to cash a check, to board a plane, to gain entrance into a government building, to drive a car, to take ACT/SAT exam, etc. Is it really asking too much to require voters to verify their identity by presenting valid photo identification? Again, some say that some people are very poor and cannot afford to obtain a photo identification - and these individuals should not be excluded from exercising their American right to vote. I call BS on this. Yes, there may be tiny percentage of the black population that cannot scrounge up between $10 and $25 to pay for a state ID. But I see these "poor" people everyday when I'm fueling up at the gas station. They seem to have enough money to buy cigarettes and lottery scratch-off tickets on a daily basis. I'm betting that 98% of them can sacrifice the money necessary to purchase a state ID.
Now, in fairness, there are a number of elderly persons or disabled persons on fixed incomes (social security, SSI) who have to choose between buying groceries and paying for medication. These individuals (whether black, white, or otherwise) probably cannot afford to purchase an ID. But the irony is that in order to draw a fixed income from Social Security or obtain subsidy housing, they had to provide valid identification at some point.
I could rant on 50 other issues that burn me, but I won't today. Suffice it to say that I'm tired of the way the black community has embraced or made excuses for its mediocrity. And now, many want lawmakers to accommodate this mediocrity as well. Damn shame...smh
I am trying to figure out how they voting ID issue is racist as well. Especially when my own cousin (1996) voted in a Presidential election and was not even a US citizen. If you want to do damn near anything that an adult does, you pretty much need a form of identification.
I also feel that disenfranchising and denying financial aid to young people who have a felony in their record on contributes to them furthering their criminal pursuits.
Very good point; that's an example of a counterproductive "institutional mechanism" alluded to in my initial post.
I appreciate your comment, but I'd like to respond by making the following points:
1) I was not born middle class or given any advantage because of my socio-economic status. To the contrary, I was raised in a lower income neighborhood and my family moved to a working class inner -city neighborhood in my early teen years.
2) My parents were not college educated (at that time one could obtain a decent job out of high school and actual work experience was considered as valuable as a college degree in certain fields). Nonetheless, my parents instilled in me the value of a "quality" education - and they taught me that it was my responsibility to always do my best and to get the most out of my educational experiences. Yes, I was surrounded by other knuckleheads who did not apply themselves or take serious their education. However, my parents did not allow me to falter in school and held me accountable because they wanted the best for me.
3) My parents taught me to respect the law. They said, "You break the law, you go to jail...period. Yes, times are rough out here for black families. And yes, the criminal justice system seems to target young blacks more harshly than other demographics. Even more reason why you better stay your behind off the street corners. Don't give them a reason to target you."
4) I was not the recipient of any quota program during my collegiate or post-graduate studies. I earned my grades (whether good or bad) and I earned the scores I received on my entrance exams, college exams, LSAT, etc. I'm not saying this for any special recognition...heck, that's the way it should be. Moreover, I had to pay my own way through school (in addition to loans) and it took me nearly six years to graduate from undergraduate school.
5) I have encountered racism in many forms from white people at every level of my educational and professional life. I understand that it's very real and is something that impacts America and the black community to some extent.
6) I have "given back" to the black community and tried to draw from my experiences to encourage and inspire young people and adults that success is attainable and should be expected. I've participated in the Upward Bound Program, the Strive Towards Excellence Program, and other similar programs. These programs are helpful, and even essential in some cases...but I've found that there is NO SUBSTITUTE FOR PARENTING.
7) I have also come to conclude that a good portion of the black community does not want to hear anything critical as it applies to them. You asked "what am I doing about it?" Sometimes, it's not about what others can do for you, it's about what you can do for yourself. I think the best thing that I can say to young black kids is to take responsbility for your actions, your education, and your future...because it's yours. Don't make excuses. Don't blame other black people who left the hood. Don't blame the white man. In my experience, however, such messages are often met with resistance or outright hostility.
The clarity and quality of your posts should be an example to all posters
I commend you and appreciate your contributions to these boards and hope to see many more in the future.
Permanently changing the blight of lower class Blacks is not about throwing more money or more programs at them, it will be done by changing the overall mentality. Sadly, this is going to be the most difficult aspect because each generation grows more entrenched into the counterproductive mentality and it is reinforced by pop culture and normalized.
You made a very insightful point, not to mention one that will be very challenging to implement, particularly in this very polarized and divisive climate.
One way to get the poorer people some skills and jobs, is to keep funding their programs, but create assistive government type jobs that would pay them a $1 or $2 per hour extra. Teachers aides, office assistants, janitorial, mechanic, whatever apprentice jobs could be set up. This would help the shrinking government offices, cost less than fully qualified positions, give poorer people on the program a little extra money, work experience, learning skills, etc. I would also set up some basic life skills classes, child care, nutrition, budgeting, etc. Anyone remember Home Ech? Having to take care of an egg to teach you about taking care of a baby? Do they even do that any more?
Please re-read my post. I do not dispute that seniors are more impacted by these laws (I happen to agree with you), nor did I claim that these laws were put into place to target just blacks. I was simply responding to the rhetoric that I've heard recently from pundits and others who are claiming that these laws unfairly target black voters. In my post, I assumed that to be true just for the sake of argument.
And yes, I happen to be black. What? Do you think a black person is unable to think objectively and independently, even if that means taking an unpopular stance related to the black community? Don't answer...that was rhetorical.
What the anti's on voter ID ignore most of the time is that most states offer FREE Id pictures and will provide transportation to get it.
I think providing transportation is ridiculous unless it can be proven you NEVER go out anywhere, anytime for anything.
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