A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms (violent crime, abortion)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
And what is your solution? Gun control is a total joke. And you know it. Your solution is "gun banning." You want NO guns in the hands of "private persons." For the record here, I am NOT a private person. I am one of the few who would have a gun, as a sworn police officer. However, I shall move on.
So, let us ban ALL guns. As of January 1, 2013. NO private ownership of guns. You and all of the other liberals slap each other on the backs and declare, "victory." Now what? The guns I own, which are actually very few, will be on the earth, when your great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandchildren are dead. They will last 1,000 years plus. That is for the 4 personally owned firearms I have. What about the entire United States? The MILLIONS of guns out there, which will last for the next thousand years. What about them?
Or do you and all the other liberal gun control advocates, advocate sending men/women into peoples homes, searching them, violating the 4th Amendment, et al to confiscate said guns? Are you for that? Do you realize the number of gun fights you would be sending the police into and the number of deaths there would be?
Do you understand, right now, as we speak, THOUSANDS of persons are buying guns, ammunition, etc and placing them in waterproof containers and burying them all over the country? What? Are you going to arrest and incarcerate, ALL of these people because they cannot provide you and your liberal cohorts with those guns? What about the illegal gun trade which will spring up across the Mexican Border? China, and every other country in the world, will make MILLIONS of AK's, etc and send them to Mexico. The drug cartels will smuggle them into the US, just like marijuana and crank.
Oh but the people will turn them in if requested. Yes, SOME will. The majority will not. Then what? What then? Kick in doors and confiscate them? I've already addressed that. Are you going to do that? I won't. I'd refuse. So were back to square one. Gun control is a lie. Its another feel good measure, to make some limp wristed liberals sleep good at night and feel as if they made a difference. They, of course, have not. But hell, it looks good.
Excellent post. I think it's important to note that gun control doesn't actually do any good, but that doesn't matter, because that's not what it's about. Fundamentally, gun control is about making people feel better about themselves. I also think it's important to note that gun control is not fundamentally a left/right issue, I'm not a Republican, but I am firmly against gun control. In my local area, the conservative talk show host is supposedly a Republican, but he has, on several occasions, had on air tirades in support of an assault weapons ban. On the other hand, there are many Democrats (I know several) who are opposed to gun control. Gun control is about thinkers vs feelers. If you think about the issue in a calm, rational manner, it's obvious that gun control won't change anything (except disarm law abiding citizens), but if you're the type who makes decisions based on your emotions, gun control feels really good because you're taking evil guns off the street.
Excellent post. I think it's important to note that gun control doesn't actually do any good, but that doesn't matter, because that's not what it's about. Fundamentally, gun control is about making people feel better about themselves. I also think it's important to note that gun control is not fundamentally a left/right issue, I'm not a Republican, but I am firmly against gun control. In my local area, the conservative talk show host is supposedly a Republican, but he has, on several occasions, had on air tirades in support of an assault weapons ban. On the other hand, there are many Democrats (I know several) who are opposed to gun control. Gun control is about thinkers vs feelers. If you think about the issue in a calm, rational manner, it's obvious that gun control won't change anything (except disarm law abiding citizens), but if you're the type who makes decisions based on your emotions, gun control feels really good because you're taking evil guns off the street.
The Government 'knows' that this is how the 'Feel Gooders' think but .. The Government has a more sinister reason for Gun Grabbing!
You did a fine job of explaining the first half of the weapons ban movement so I'll bet that you can do as well in explaining the second half!?
2nd Amendment or not, 2013 will be the year that the gun culture club gets the wake up call that it has had coming. Threads like this only make the case for some kind of revisit of the Framer's Document. Tell me something else besides the Bible and the Constitution that resists progress so obsessively.
H
As far as the Constitution is concerned what you label progress I label tyranny.
The Government 'knows' that this is how the 'Feel Gooders' think but .. The Government has a more sinister reason for Gun Grabbing!
You did a fine job of explaining the first half of the weapons ban movement so I'll bet that you can do as well in explaining the second half!?
Well, I try not be cynical and think about the 'control' aspect of gun control, but I will certainly admit that it exists. Our founding fathers absolutely knew this, and one of the primary causes of our revolution was the British government confiscating civilian arms (this also figured prominently in India). I know that there are some at the top who do not want an armed populace, and they will play the heartstrings of every day Americans like a fiddle in an effort to gain support for gun control. I think, for true supporters of liberty, our best argument is to point out the numerous logical fallacies of gun control legislation, and stray away from shadowy overtures of evil and conspiratorial governments. As supporters of freedom, we have to shed the cliches that we believe in a new world order or that we are afraid that the Feds are coming for our guns, because that's not likely, and paints us in the corner of extremists. We're not extremists, we're supporters of freedom and liberty, and we acknowledge the fact that firearms are the right hand of liberty. To steal from one of my favorite politicians, Daniel Hannan (a British representative in the EU), what makes the United States a great country comes from the fact our institutions elevate the individual to being the most important member of our government. The first words in the United States constitution are "We the people," while the first words in the European Union constitution are "his majesty the king of the Belgians." If that doesn't say something about the priority the USA puts on individual rights, I don't know what does.
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
And yet they have 'infringed' and will continue to TRY and 'infringe' ever further!
Actually, the wording of the 2nd amendment is deceptive.
"People have the right to bear arms" -but- militiamen are under the legal obligation to train, fight, and die on command.
By law, all able bodied male citizens, 17-45, are the militia. And the militia CAN be regulated in the manner in which they "bear arms"... they're under orders.
The Supreme Court has held, in Butler v. Perry, 240 U.S. 328 (1916), that the Thirteenth Amendment does not prohibit "enforcement of those duties which individuals owe to the state, such as services in the army, MILITIA, on the jury, etc." In Selective Draft Law Cases, 245 U.S. 366 (1918), the Supreme Court ruled that the military draft was not "involuntary servitude".
If not involuntary servitude banned by the 13th amendment, it must be VOLUNTARY SERVITUDE.
Okay - the militiamen VOLUNTEERED to be so regulated.
No problem.
Citizenship is a voluntary assertion. If citizenship was imposed at birth, that would make civic duties into involuntary servitude, and banned by the 13th amendment.
Moving on.
Reference:
Title 10 USC Sec. 311. Militia: composition and classes
Title 50 USC Sec. 453. Registration (Selective Service)
Art. 1, Sec. 8, USCON (1789)
Congress shall have power ... To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
Articles of Confederation, VI. (1777)
...every State shall always keep up a well-regulated and disciplined militia, sufficiently armed and accoutered, and shall provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of filed pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition and camp equipage.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.