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Old 08-04-2012, 10:33 AM
 
3,304 posts, read 2,162,792 times
Reputation: 2390

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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Yes I do understand group statistics and averages.

However -- if you're going to want to solve the problems of groups, then you have to look at the whole picture -- of course Asians as well as Germans, and Swedes and many others come here and do very well. One reason is that our borders are so very open to all who want to come here and take the jobs. We allow that. Americans who are at a disadvantage that goes back several generations in their family are not being given jobs -- their would be jobs are given to foreigners. So of course the foreigner has the advantage over the American.

Imagine if instead of welfare and open borders, that America (like the Asians do) actually took care of our own? Asians here make sure Asians are given jobs, we don't make sure Americans are given jobs.
Your belief system seems to be all over the place. A job is not a right or something a person should be given just because of his background. That attitude leads to low productivity and poor competitiveness. A job, any job, has to be seen as a means to personal growth and empowerment. It is not, or at least shouldn't be, something that is granted. If a person see his job as an opportunity, then he will strive to be an asset. This attitude creates success for those employed and those that have hired them. If a person thinks that they deserve a job just because they live and breathe, then that person will be a poor employee and someone that isn't desired.

You write of the problems of welfare, but you approach employment as if it were a form of welfare.

 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:36 AM
 
4,183 posts, read 6,507,109 times
Reputation: 1734
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supachai View Post
Your belief system seems to be all over the place. A job is not a right or something a person should be given just because of his background. That attitude leads to low productivity and poor competitiveness. A job, any job, has to be seen as a means to personal growth and empowerment. It is not, or at least shouldn't be, something that is granted. If a person see his job as an opportunity, then he will strive to be an asset. This attitude creates success for those employed and those that have hired them. If a person thinks that they deserve a job just because they live and breathe, then that person will be a poor employee and someone that isn't desired.

You write of the problems of welfare, but you approach employment as if it were a form of welfare.
Good post.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:36 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,505,452 times
Reputation: 22472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supachai View Post
Your belief system seems to be all over the place. A job is not a right or something a person should be given just because of his background. That attitude leads to low productivity and poor competitiveness. A job, any job, has to be seen as a means to personal growth and empowerment. It is not, or at least shouldn't be, something that is granted. If a person see his job as an opportunity, then he will strive to be an asset. This attitude creates success for those employed and those that have hired them. If a person thinks that they deserve a job just because they live and breathe, then that person will be a poor employee and someone that isn't desired.

You write of the problems of welfare, but you approach employment as if it were a form of welfare.
Actually that is you guys doing that. On one hand you're praising the Asians for making sure that they give other Asians a job --- which they do even if they discriminate against Americans in doing so. Why do Asians give other Asians jobs? It is because of their background, because they know that it's jobs that get you a great foothold here.

Do Americans make sure we give jobs to Americans ahead of others? No. Never. Yet the Asians come here and do just that for other Asians.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:38 AM
 
4,183 posts, read 6,507,109 times
Reputation: 1734
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Actually that is you guys doing that. On one hand you're praising the Asians for making sure that they give other Asians a job --- which they do even if they discriminate against Americans in doing so. Why do Asians give other Asians jobs? It is because of their background, because they know that it's jobs that get you a great foothold here.

Do Americans make sure we give jobs to Americans ahead of others? No. Never. Yet the Asians come here and do just that for other Asians.
Deport all Asians! They're stealing American jobs!
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:40 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,222,269 times
Reputation: 27718
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
It didn't exactly end 150 years ago. The field workers were released en masse - but then what did they have? They still had Jim Crowe laws, they still couldn't use the same drinking fountain, many were denied a good education, they still couldn't get hired in many jobs. Even today, Obama is busy getting illegals their work visas but is doing absolutely nothing to get American kids into jobs. That's just another generation that won't make it.

I also blame the liberal politics and of course the government handout programs which isn't like giving someone a job and it keeps them jobless and at the bottom. Many social problems become generational.
It's been about 45 years since the civil rights movement. Easily that's 2-3 generations now since the 60's and it's the same sad song.."Jim Crowe laws made us victims".
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:41 AM
 
Location: Bayou City
3,028 posts, read 5,199,666 times
Reputation: 2546
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Plus -- since this is a dig at blacks -- as a group because people like to judge others by their race group not as individuals, the Asians immigrants and all immigrants did not have the same history of slavery and institutionalized racism in this country.

Asians come over and are handed all kinds of refugee money, most arrived after the government safety nets were well in place. Many are bright enough to learn English and adapt well -- but they also as a group they've had a lot of advantages that blacks never had. Many Asians come over to take the programming and other computer jobs that Americans won't do. Many come as highly paid physicians. There is no history of Asian slavery in this country so really Asians like other immigrants have no excuse at all to do poorly.
This.

Moreover, the very segregationist policies that served to exclude blacks from most areas of modern life simply did not affect Asian-Americans overall to the same degree. In the military, for instance, many Asian-Americans served with whites even prior to the desegregation of the armed services. Most schools and universities that were otherwise racially restrictive vis-a-vis blacks were not so with Asian-Americans. In fact, I personally knew a Chinese woman whose family settled in Louisiana upon arrival to the states in the 50's. She attended school with whites, and her family was allowed to live in a white suburb.

Even in California, where historical anti-Asian sentiment was perhaps most concentrated, institutionalized discrimination was transitory and sporadic at best. And where instances of discrimination did exist, many Asian groups could easily take refuge in their own respective ethnic enclaves where they could find jobs, housing, loans, etc.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:42 AM
miu
 
Location: MA/NH
17,764 posts, read 40,056,684 times
Reputation: 18067
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Plus -- since this is a dig at blacks -- as a group because people like to judge others by their race group not as individuals, the Asians immigrants and all immigrants did not have the same history of slavery and institutionalized racism in this country.
The way the Chinese were treated when they first arrived in the US was pretty darn awful. They were used as cheap labour in building the western half of the Trans Continental Railroad. Sure they weren't slaves, but they were subject to racism and with their cheap wages, they had to pay for their own food and board. Plus, Chinese immigrants weren't allowed to bring over their wives. They were only needed for menial labour and never got any welcome to stay in the US as equal citizens. Americans just wanted to use the Chinese for cheap expendable labour and for them to go back to China when the railroad was finished.

The Asian experience is really not much different from what the blacks went through. Just like the blacks, Asians can't blend in with the general population due to their skin colour and facial features. And another thing in common is that for a long time, many Asians and blacks in the US lived in urban areas, and in areas that the whites no longer wanted to live in.

Quote:
Asians come over and are handed all kinds of refugee money, most arrived after the government safety nets were well in place. Many are bright enough to learn English and adapt well -- but they also as a group they've had a lot of advantages that blacks never had. Many Asians come over to take the programming and other computer jobs that Americans won't do. Many come as highly paid physicians. There is no history of Asian slavery in this country so really Asians like other immigrants have no excuse at all to do poorly.
So not true!!! The Chinese, Japanese and Koreans were NOT given any refugee money. In WWII, the Japanese Americans were thrown into internment camps. Perhaps you are thinking of the Vietnamese boat people in regards to getting refugee money.

Asians pool their family resources, work two full time menial jobs and are willing to live in crowded conditions in order to attain their goals. And when we don't have the money, we don't waste it on stupid bling in an effort to show others that we are "ballers".
.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:46 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,505,452 times
Reputation: 22472
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
It's been about 45 years since the civil rights movement. Easily that's 2-3 generations now since the 60's and it's the same sad song.."Jim Crowe laws made us victims".
It doesn't matter -- most of us get most our our early learning and even attitudes from our parents and grandparents and they got theirs from their parents and grandparents.

There was never any effort made to get the underclass black Americans jobs -- welfare handouts didn't attempt to do that.

Asian and other successful immigrant groups can be admired in some ways because they will work and they will learn English and adapt to our culture -- but they still come with many advantages. Just like their tendency to hire their own -- we don't do that as a culture. We will bring in foreigners and let American citizens rot. So we're admiring Asians for something that we as a culture do not do.

It's not just slavery but also the aftermath of it, the way so many people were released with no where to go and just left to flounder. Of course many have succeeded in spite of that -- but a portion has not. They will never succeed if they never have jobs.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:47 AM
miu
 
Location: MA/NH
17,764 posts, read 40,056,684 times
Reputation: 18067
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Actually that is you guys doing that. On one hand you're praising the Asians for making sure that they give other Asians a job --- which they do even if they discriminate against Americans in doing so. Why do Asians give other Asians jobs? It is because of their background, because they know that it's jobs that get you a great foothold here.

Do Americans make sure we give jobs to Americans ahead of others? No. Never. Yet the Asians come here and do just that for other Asians.
No other Asian has ever given me a hookup for a job. My excellent English and the quality of my work skills are what get me work, and I get offered work all of the time.

In the US, the better ones English speaking skills, the more doors are opened for work and friendship opportunities. I really don't understand the appeal of acting all urban hip and cool 24/7. That attitude is for immature teenagers.
 
Old 08-04-2012, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,222,269 times
Reputation: 27718
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Actually that is you guys doing that. On one hand you're praising the Asians for making sure that they give other Asians a job --- which they do even if they discriminate against Americans in doing so. Why do Asians give other Asians jobs? It is because of their background, because they know that it's jobs that get you a great foothold here.

Do Americans make sure we give jobs to Americans ahead of others? No. Never. Yet the Asians come here and do just that for other Asians.
Are they not "Americans" as well ?

You seem to think this only happens with Asians ? No.
Go to any McDonalds..whatever race the manager is will be the predominent race of the employees.
I've seen the McDonald's in my town go from White to Hispanic to Black back to White all based on the Manager.
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