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Old 08-22-2012, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Arizona
13,054 posts, read 7,783,816 times
Reputation: 6937

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I see the handlers of the radical right have instructed their minions to "go forth and shout it from the rooftops and in the ears of all who would listen" Obama raised taxes!!! This is a tried and true strategy that has been used by all political parties against their opponents since Cain and Abel disagreed on how the family farm should be run. No truth to it at all, but you tell a lie over and over and when people finally expose it for what it is, you change the wording and retell the same lie. "My opponent will raise your taxes, my candidate will cut your taxes". It's the oldest cut and paste political message there is.
Saying Obama raises taxes with the mandate and PGHquest's circular logic is the same as claiming that "Jesus Christ raised your taxes!!!" The logic is that he started a new religion that fostered revolt and rebellion in the empire, thereby causing new troops to be dispatched to the troublesome areas requiring the Roman Senate to raise taxes on the middle class to pay for the troops. Jesus swore he would stay out of the finances of the government when he said, "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and to God, the things that are God's", But he LIED! He ended up raising taxes for everybody. That no good Hypocrite! Lets hang his ass. Better yet, lets crucify him!

My point is, you guys start thread after thread trying to push your circular logic and my bet is most arn't buying it. You'll need to develop a different angle if you intend to close the credibility gap this election cycle. With all due respect for your efforts of course.

Last edited by mohawkx; 08-22-2012 at 11:48 AM..
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:33 AM
 
Location: ATX-HOU
10,218 posts, read 6,777,744 times
Reputation: 2033
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
So let me see if I get this straight, if businesses increase their costs, in order to comply with the law, you somehow believe this will reduce the costs.. What world are you living in? And while you're there, tell me how the bill raises $600B if there is no increased cost.. Tell me where where this money will come from and how it can be paid for without increasing costs... Do you live with Santa Clause?
No you are missing the point. Some companies and businesses already offer benefits that aren't required by law, you know like health care and 401k. My company isn't going broke because it is providing me health care and contributing to my 401k, they factor it into the cost of business.
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:33 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,381,403 times
Reputation: 9358
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
I see the handlers of the radical right have instructed their minions to "go forth and shout it from the rooftops and in the ears of all who would listen" Obama raised taxes!!! This is a tried and true strategy that has been used by all political parties against their opponents since Cain and Abel disagreed on how the family farm should be run. No truth to it at all, but you tell a lie over and over and when people finally expose it for what it is, you change the wording and retell the same lie. "My opponent will raise your taxes, my candidate will cut your taxes". It's the oldest cut and paste political message there is.
Saying Obama raises taxes with the mandate and PGHquest's circular logic is the same as claiming that "Jesus Christ raised your taxes!!!" The logic is that he started a new religion that fostered revolt and rebellion in the empire, thereby causing new troops to be dispatched to the troublesome areas requiring the Roman Senate to raise taxes on the middle class to pay for the troops. Jesus swore he would stay out of the finances of the government when he said, "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and to God, the things that are God's", But he LIED! He ended up raising taxes for everybody. That no good Hypocrite! Lets hang his ass. Better yet, lets crucify him!

My point is, you guys start thread after thread trying to push your circular logic and my bet is most arn't buying it. You'll need to develop a different angle if you intend to close the credibility gap this election cycle.
tax increases in Obamacare which will affect the middle class

Tax increases signed by Obama into law
$17B new taxes for those who do not purchase health insurance
$52B new taxes for those who fail to comply with government insurance mandates
$32B in a new 40% exercise tax on high cost health plans
$5B cost of new ban on over the counter drugs using money from FSAs, HSAs, HRA's.
$210.2B Increased medicare taxes on wages and self employed income by .9% and imposes a 3.8% surtax on other investment income.
$15.2B cost due to an increase from 7.5% to 10% of income in threahold after which individuals can deduct out of pocket medical expenses
$13B due to a $2,500 annual cap on FSA contributions
$60.1B in new taxes on health insurances
$27B annual tax on brand name pharmaceuticals
$20B tax from a 2.3% excise tax on medical devices
$2.7B tax from a 10% tax on tanning services
$2.6B tax on insured and self insured health plans
$1.4B penalty tax on non qualified HSA distributions
$4.5B tax due to the elimination of a deduction for expenses allocatable to Medicare Part D subsidy
$600M tax due to limited deductions for compensation to officers, employers and directors of health insurance providers
$17.1B to require information reporting on payments to corporations.
$400M to impose additional requirements for section 501(c)(3) for hospitals
$23.6B tax credit removed a "black liquor" needed for cellulosic biofuel producer.
$4.5B Codify economic substance doctrine and impose penalties for underpayments.
$65.5B tax hikes in the SCHIP bill
$6.97B tax hike in the stimulus bill to repeal guidance allowing taxpayers to claim losses from acquired corporations
$2.578B tax hike in unemployment benefits law creating a surcharge tax extension through 6/11
$20.123B cost to delay the rules to reduce the double taxation of american employers until 2018.


And no amount of hate you post will make this not true
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
14,802 posts, read 13,272,642 times
Reputation: 4490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
President Obama made a vow and a promise when he was campaigning for president in 2008 - he said that he would pass health care legislation and he promised that he would not raise taxes on those making less than $250,000/year. He accomplished the first - with the PPACA passing the house by a measly 7 votes - hailed by many as his biggest achievement. But the law raised taxes in the form of including an individual mandate for Americans to purchase government approved health insurance or be financially penalized. The tax increase was affirmed as such in the Supreme Court's ruling.

NATIONAL FEDERATION OF INDEPENDENT BUSINESS et al. v. SEBELIUS, SECRETARY OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES, et al. | Supreme Court | LII / Legal Information Institute .

Do you really want to vote for a man whose biggest achievement is breaking a campaign promise?
Since when didn't a president break a campaign promise? After paying for my health insurance for many years, I don't feel that all of a sudden it has become a tax. Besides that, health care for everyone doesn't come free. It's as simple as that. IF you quite passionately feel that health care is not to be regarded as a human right, then who is going to pay the burial expenses for needy people who drop dead from not having the money to pay the doctor, or for life saving medications?
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:35 AM
 
Location: ATX-HOU
10,218 posts, read 6,777,744 times
Reputation: 2033
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
I see the handlers of the radical right have instructed their minions to "go forth and shout it from the rooftops and in the ears of all who would listen" Obama raised taxes!!! This is a tried and true strategy that has been used by all political parties against their opponents since Cain and Abel disagreed on how the family farm should be run. No truth to it at all, but you tell a lie over and over and when people finally expose it for what it is, you change the wording and retell the same lie. "My opponent will raise your taxes, my candidate will cut your taxes". It's the oldest cut and paste political message there is.
Saying Obama raises taxes with the mandate and PGHquest's circular logic is the same as claiming that "Jesus Christ raised your taxes!!!" The logic is that he started a new religion that fostered revolt and rebellion in the empire, thereby causing new troops to be dispatched to the troublesome areas requiring the Roman Senate to raise taxes on the middle class to pay for the troops. Jesus swore he would stay out of the finances of the government when he said, "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and to God, the things that are God's", But he LIED! He ended up raising taxes for everybody. That no good Hypocrite! Lets hang his ass. Better yet, lets crucify him!

My point is, you guys start thread after thread trying to push your circular logic and my bet is most arn't buying it. You'll need to develop a different angle if you intend to close the credibility gap this election cycle.
This. Partisanship just leads to ignorance.
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:36 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,381,403 times
Reputation: 9358
Quote:
Originally Posted by dv1033 View Post
No you are missing the point. Some companies and businesses already offer benefits that aren't required by law, you know like health care and 401k. My company isn't going broke because it is providing me health care and contributing to my 401k, they factor it into the cost of business.
I never said your company was going to go broke, I said the taxes will be passed onto your company and your company will pass them onto the consumer. The fact that they wont go broke, doesnt mean they arent there.

If this isnt true, then tell me how Obamacare raises $600 BILLION in new tax revenues..
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,125 posts, read 21,975,499 times
Reputation: 6128

Pelosi: we have to pass the health care bill so that you can find out what is in it - YouTube

I think that the Madam Speaker knew what was in the bill - and wanted to hide that until it became law.
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
14,802 posts, read 13,272,642 times
Reputation: 4490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brawny1 View Post
This isn't the only campaign promise broken, but a large one. The shape of the economy, unemployment, cut the deficit in half, close Guantamamo, etc., make this election choice a no brainer...
And Romney knows how to make the economy go nuts by simply abolishing ObamaCare and make big tax cuts for the rich with no guarantee that jobs that are supposed to be created as a result don't go to China?
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Arizona
13,054 posts, read 7,783,816 times
Reputation: 6937
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
tax increases in Obamacare which will affect the middle class

Tax increases signed by Obama into law
$17B new taxes for those who do not purchase health insurance
$52B new taxes for those who fail to comply with government insurance mandates
$32B in a new 40% exercise tax on high cost health plans
$5B cost of new ban on over the counter drugs using money from FSAs, HSAs, HRA's.
$210.2B Increased medicare taxes on wages and self employed income by .9% and imposes a 3.8% surtax on other investment income.
$15.2B cost due to an increase from 7.5% to 10% of income in threahold after which individuals can deduct out of pocket medical expenses
$13B due to a $2,500 annual cap on FSA contributions
$60.1B in new taxes on health insurances
$27B annual tax on brand name pharmaceuticals
$20B tax from a 2.3% excise tax on medical devices
$2.7B tax from a 10% tax on tanning services
$2.6B tax on insured and self insured health plans
$1.4B penalty tax on non qualified HSA distributions
$4.5B tax due to the elimination of a deduction for expenses allocatable to Medicare Part D subsidy
$600M tax due to limited deductions for compensation to officers, employers and directors of health insurance providers
$17.1B to require information reporting on payments to corporations.
$400M to impose additional requirements for section 501(c)(3) for hospitals
$23.6B tax credit removed a "black liquor" needed for cellulosic biofuel producer.
$4.5B Codify economic substance doctrine and impose penalties for underpayments.
$65.5B tax hikes in the SCHIP bill
$6.97B tax hike in the stimulus bill to repeal guidance allowing taxpayers to claim losses from acquired corporations
$2.578B tax hike in unemployment benefits law creating a surcharge tax extension through 6/11
$20.123B cost to delay the rules to reduce the double taxation of american employers until 2018.


And no amount of hate you post will make this not true
what hate? There's no hate there at all. Just irony.
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Old 08-22-2012, 11:44 AM
 
69,372 posts, read 55,381,403 times
Reputation: 9358
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
what hate? There's no hate there at all. Just irony.
Then why did you bring up jesus and religion in a thread discussing taxes? To an agnostic no less.. Thats pretty dumb. You didnt at all respond to anything I aid.. just babbled your hate for religion... Weird
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