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Old 09-08-2012, 03:14 PM
 
409 posts, read 491,324 times
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How do these people who say that don't have valid ID to vote get along in society?



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Last edited by CaseyB; 09-09-2012 at 05:01 AM.. Reason: copyright
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Old 09-08-2012, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Maryland
628 posts, read 824,135 times
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Buying train tickets? Using credits card? Never needed it for the former, almost never for the latter.

Some of those other things allow non-picture IDs (such as library cards), while others don't require ID per se but do require proof of residence (which is all that is required to get a library card...).
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Old 09-08-2012, 03:33 PM
 
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There is virtually nothing on that list that requires proof of citizenship. I can do virtually all of those things in England or Mexico.

So what does this have to do with having proof of citizenship via a photo ID to vote?

Even a number of the exposes of illegal voting dealt with non-citizens or convicted felons who would have suitable ID even though they should be ineligible to vote.

In general the campaign is to keep the poor from voting...many of whom may be black.
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Old 09-08-2012, 04:49 PM
 
731 posts, read 1,366,983 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lvoc View Post
There is virtually nothing on that list that requires proof of citizenship. I can do virtually all of those things in England or Mexico.

So what does this have to do with having proof of citizenship via a photo ID to vote?

Even a number of the exposes of illegal voting dealt with non-citizens or convicted felons who would have suitable ID even though they should be ineligible to vote.

In general the campaign is to keep the poor from voting...many of whom may be black.
I beg to differ. First of all the OP says those things on the list require valid ID, not proof of citizenship.
I don't know where you live but in Okla. a valid ID is a government issued ID or a valid driver's license (photo id) If you are driving, you better have a driver license (photo id) if you get stopped. A person has to provide a valid ID to open a checking account, making a credit card transaction in retail stores, enrolling in schools, buying a firearm, opening any accounts thru the bank, making applications to buy cars, applications for mortgages when buying property, registering professional license, outpatient testing at hospitals, in fact, almost everything on that list ultimately starts with giving a copy of a valid ID (photo id) with the exception of buying cigarettes and alcohol. Even then, WalMart will ask for an ID when buying cigarettes. The computer randomly generates this request. I would have to check with the voting board but I believe a felon would show up as ineligible to vote with all the databases available.

Providing a photo ID would show if the illegal voter was using correct proof of his/her identity not citizenship. The issue was not citizenship. You know what, I was stopped at the Mexico border and had to show my valid ID to re-enter the U.S. I guess I look mexican.
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Old 09-08-2012, 04:51 PM
 
Location: The land of infinite variety!
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How many of those are rights guaranteed under the Constitution to every American?
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Old 09-08-2012, 05:39 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 12,703,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinynot View Post
I beg to differ. First of all the OP says those things on the list require valid ID, not proof of citizenship.
I don't know where you live but in Okla. a valid ID is a government issued ID or a valid driver's license (photo id) If you are driving, you better have a driver license (photo id) if you get stopped. A person has to provide a valid ID to open a checking account, making a credit card transaction in retail stores, enrolling in schools, buying a firearm, opening any accounts thru the bank, making applications to buy cars, applications for mortgages when buying property, registering professional license, outpatient testing at hospitals, in fact, almost everything on that list ultimately starts with giving a copy of a valid ID (photo id) with the exception of buying cigarettes and alcohol. Even then, WalMart will ask for an ID when buying cigarettes. The computer randomly generates this request. I would have to check with the voting board but I believe a felon would show up as ineligible to vote with all the databases available.

Providing a photo ID would show if the illegal voter was using correct proof of his/her identity not citizenship. The issue was not citizenship. You know what, I was stopped at the Mexico border and had to show my valid ID to re-enter the U.S. I guess I look mexican.
As I said. I have bought liquor and rented cars and done many things in England and Mexico without a valid Mexican or English ID. I show who I am perhaps but not that I am a Mexican or an Englishman.

Virtually all of the people identified in the various exposes had driver licenses. You do not have to be a citizen or even legal to have a US drivers license.

If the States demonstrate their is actually a problem with people using phony IDs or other people's IDs I would think there is a case for requiring ID. But that is not the case. I would also be less skeptical if the state's had a broad outreach program where they go to the distressed voter. None do.

I would also note that the big source of voter fraud is tampering with absentee ballots and such. I see no attempt to tighten this obvious area of fraud up as it is one heavily utilized by Republican voters.
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Old 09-08-2012, 05:44 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
33,816 posts, read 41,773,858 times
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I had to show ID today when I traded in/replaced my cell phone.
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Old 09-08-2012, 05:47 PM
 
Location: Maryland
628 posts, read 824,135 times
Reputation: 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinynot View Post
I beg to differ. First of all the OP says those things on the list require valid ID, not proof of citizenship.
I don't know where you live but in Okla. a valid ID is a government issued ID or a valid driver's license (photo id) If you are driving, you better have a driver license (photo id) if you get stopped. A person has to provide a valid ID to open a checking account, making a credit card transaction in retail stores,
Oh, nonsense. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I have been asked for an ID with credit card use in retail stores, and I have been using a credit card since 1990.

I can think of real live people who could have trouble with voter ID.

My grandmother's cousin "Bill" lived in a shack he inherited from his mother. He never drove, never bought a house, never bought a car, never had a credit card. He didn't have utility electricity or running water--he had a well and an outhouse and I think a generator for his ham radio. My grandmother said he lived off scratch farming and survivor benefits from his mother in old age so presumably he had a social security number. I don't know if he bought alcohol or cigarettes, but he was already an older man by the time there were strict laws about minimum ages/carding for that. And he's not the only older male in my family who lived like that (luckily his failing health was noticed and my grandmother got him into a nursing home in 2002 or so). Granted he may have been a little weird, but he didn't die so long ago--9 years ago maybe?-- and he was in his 80s. So people like this who are basically off the grid, most of them poor elderly in bad mobility situations, are going to have trouble getting this ID in time and even hearing about the requirement--yet shouldn't they have the right to vote?
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Old 09-08-2012, 05:59 PM
 
174 posts, read 76,797 times
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I never had to prove my identity when I sued the United States Government.

I went all the way through a federal trial without ever having to prove that who I said I was, I was.

Trouble is, the court decided I wasn't who I said I was, without explanation or evidence, even though I WAS who I said I was.

Guess I should have shown a valid ID.
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:32 PM
 
18,856 posts, read 31,550,552 times
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This list, just shows how completely out of touch folks are with people who live in poverty. No one living in poverty is going on a plane, train, or any of those things. You rent a room in someone's house, no ID needed for utilities. You don't have a checking account, you live on a cash only basis, you are too broke and have too many credit problems to get a checking account. Social security comes to a gov account, and you have a debit card for that.

No car, no insurance. You are so absolutely clueless about poverty. You don't get medication, you have no insurance.

Are you begininning to understand? Clueless.
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