Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I agree--it's a dumb move, and it's terrible timing for the democrats. Still, I can see the Union's point about tying employment to blanket test scores, because there are so many more factors involved in a student's success. Bad teachers should be fired, but there are lots of factors that can suppress test scores that have nothing to do with the ability of the teacher to teach. I come from a family of teachers, and unless testing is done to see improvement from the beginning to the end of the same school year, the test scores are meaningless in measuring the effectiveness of the teacher. The other issue is that kids in inner city schools are going to have lower scores because they have crappy environments at home that aren't conducive to learning. You can't expect the same scores from an inner city school as you do from a surburban school where the kids have full stomachs and parents who are home and working with them to make sure their homework is done. If you expect teachers in the inner city to actually be able to teach the kids, you have to make sure that the kids are in a position where they have the tools available to them at home to learn.
I think standardized test scores are silly too. However, all of the points you made here are valid, and yet teachers still argue for 'smaller class sizes'. Look, a smaller class size has proven through several studies not to substantially help a student's learning. Time and time again the key to success for students is culture and home life. You cannot change that with a class size of 25 vs. 35 or having an added painting course at school. The problems start and end in the home. When are the people of this nation going to step up and recognize this? And when are we going to start hiring and keeping effective teachers based on merit and not on seniority?
Unless you are a teacher you have no idea what teachers deal with on a day to day basis. Why anyone would want to become a teacher with the low pay they receive is beyond me. Teachers don't get into this profession to become rich. They do it because they care. But no one seems to appreciate them and just blame them for everything.
Low pay?!!?!??!?
Teachers in my city (Boston) average over $80,000 per year, some of them are taking in over $100,000 per year. All that while spending 1/3 of the year on vacation and only five hours per day in front of a classroom.
Over 85% of the educational budget goes to teacher salary and benefits leaving less than 15% for supplies and physical plant. Then the teachers publicly complain that they have to spend out of pocket for classroom supplies.
No offense natalie but you are living in another century with your knowledge of what is going on.
Last edited by Mr. Joshua; 09-10-2012 at 07:42 AM..
Luckily, we don't need to know what motivates them. All we need to know is that enough teachers can be had at $x per yr and that if a municipality is paying $(x+y) per yr, then the teachers are being overpaid $y.
Not only is this a great equation for teachers but it's great for all employees. It doesn't matter if they're wiping runny noses, risking their lives, or collecting tolls. The only question is whether or not a comparable quality of product can be had for less money.
That question has been answered. Charter schools provide more accountability and less cost.
The union countered by asking for a 30 percent pay raise over two years, followed by a request for a 25 percent increase over two years. Just weeks ago, Lewis told delegates the union had adjusted its demand and was asking for a 19 percent pay raise in the contract's first year.
At least they have a job with a good health benefits and pension package. And with high unemployment numbers and real estate values down, maybe it's time to stop with the pay raises for a while.
And if the teachers are feeling poor, maybe the union should look into lowering its dues to its membership.
I think standardized test scores are silly too. However, all of the points you made here are valid, and yet teachers still argue for 'smaller class sizes'. Look, a smaller class size has proven through several studies not to substantially help a student's learning. Time and time again the key to success for students is culture and home life. You cannot change that with a class size of 25 vs. 35 or having an added painting course at school. The problems start and end in the home. When are the people of this nation going to step up and recognize this? And when are we going to start hiring and keeping effective teachers based on merit and not on seniority?
Aren't liberals always saying teachers should get paid more? And I thought liberlas were pro union? So whats the problem? I guess as usual Rahm Emanuel and people of his ilk(liberals) don't practice what they preach.
Are you a teacher? I don't think you are so please don't pretend to know what you would do. If you want a computer teaching your child then go for it. Personally, I like the interaction of human contact with my children.
I'm not a teacher, but my friends and family are.
One of them just posted on facebook that she thinks this strike is ridiculous.
This is not a smart move, certainly at this time. Some Unions do not get it. There complaint is about accurate problems, but the timing of the method of working on those, is awfully self-defeating. Poor Union Leadership in Chicago.
I agree.
I can't believe the teachers would think that this is a good time to shut down the school system in one of the largest cities in the country.
Why? I already know the common arguments. Not paid enough, etc etc.
Below is a link, and on that link is what a first year teacher earns and their benefits.
. For the 2011-2012 school year, first-year teachers earned $47,250 annually; teachers with a master’s degree were eligible to earn supplemental pay (around $3,000 annually).* After 1 month, this includes med/dental insurance etc
[quote] SALARIES AND BENEFITS. The district offered 16 percent increase over four years and "modified step increases that both reward experience and provide better incentives for mid-career teachers."
TEACHER EVALUATIONS. The union wants to lower how much student performance contributes to evaluations. CPS has said the new evaluation system, created in collaboration with teachers, was negotiated and settled in March under state law.
Membership dues totals for calendar year 2011 are: Teachers $1,000.24
and says this
Quote:
Teachers
The Chicago Teachers Union has more than 32,000 teacher, paraprofessional and retiree members. The Union is Local 1 of the American Federation of Teachers, an Illinois Federation of Teachers affiliate and affiliated with the Chicago Federation of Labor and the AFL-CIO. The CTU is the largest local in the state and the Chicago Public School system is the third largest in the country.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Chicago Teachers to Go on Strike
