New documentary - abortion in USA... (supporter, million, medical, children)

[Marlow]

You know, since so few people are actually willing to send women who seek abortions, or their doctors, to jail if they actually obtain an abortion, maybe there is more middle-ground between the pro-choice and anti-abortion camps than meets the eye.

If the focus were to change from making abortion illegal to preventing unwanted pregnancies, people could cooperate and talk about strategies to do that. Comprehensive sex education could be taught in health classes and at church. Pre-natal development could be stressed to meet the concerns of those who feel like if women had more information about fetal development they would not choose abortions.

Funding could be sought from governmental and private sources to supply birth control to everyone, regardless of age, who seeks it. Groups who spend time and finances trying to make abortion illegal could spend their resources on education about family planning and on providing financial and emotional resources to women who find themselves facing an unwanted pregnancy.

As soon as an abortion debate begins people take the sides they've been on since 1973. For people who are serious about decreasing the number of abortions, maybe it's time to shift the focus.

[mbmouse]

Originally Posted by Marlow

You know, since so few people are actually willing to send women who seek abortions, or their doctors, to jail if they actually obtain an abortion, maybe there is more middle-ground between the pro-choice and anti-abortion camps than meets the eye.

If the focus were to change from making abortion illegal to preventing unwanted pregnancies, people could cooperate and talk about strategies to do that. Comprehensive sex education could be taught in health classes and at church. Pre-natal development could be stressed to meet the concerns of those who feel like if women had more information about fetal development they would not choose abortions.

Funding could be sought from governmental and private sources to supply birth control to everyone, regardless of age, who seeks it. Groups who spend time and finances trying to make abortion illegal could spend their resources on education about family planning and on providing financial and emotional resources to women who find themselves facing an unwanted pregnancy.

As soon as an abortion debate begins people take the sides they've been on since 1973. For people who are serious about decreasing the number of abortions, maybe it's time to shift the focus.

Very well said, and I agree. I believe the "pro choice" should be about more than just abortions. Lets face it, how can one make a good choice if they do not have all the information needed to make the choice?

[movingtolou]

Originally Posted by Noahma

Is a tape worm a living thing? after all it cannot survive without a host to feed off of.

The ultrasound we have of my little girl shows her sucking her thumb, and placing her left leg over her right leg while laying back (very relaxed look) well wouldn't you know it, she does the EXACT same thing when we put her down for bed at 2 years old.

An unborn baby has 50% of moms DNA, and 50% of dads DNA, undoubtedly HUMAN DNA. I think the dad should have just as much say as the mom, the whole "i carried the baby for 9 mo." thing to be a lame cop out. I have carried my daughter probably just as long in her life so far. Yes I can put her down for a few min. but I still carry her, spend sleepless nights with her when she is sick, help her when she is hurt. While I let my wife sleep / sit back and watch.

If its such a big concern that mom might be left with the baby after a sperm donor runs off, there is ADOPTION. There are thousands of people that cannot conceive a baby, and would give anything to be parents.


(no I am not making any comparisons that a baby is a tape worm, other than showing that both are equally alive)

Here's the thing. I have two children...carried them myself. In fact, due to hormonal changes in pregnancy, even had to have a gallbladder removed...Carrying a child for 10 (not 9, as a pregnancy is 40wks) months in in no way a lame 'cop out'. I was never MORE certain of that, until after I did it. It is not JUST about holding a child most of the time so your wife can sleep.

It is just simply a decision that each woman should be empowered to make; women should not be considered 'incubators'... It is not within anyone else's right to make that decision for someone else.

I, for example breastfed both of my children for a year...because research shows it to be beneficial. I would never presume to tell another woman what to do, or judge, or tell her 'she doesn't care about her children' because she's not doing what's best for them; it's her body. The same goes for what you feed your children. I do what works for us.

And on the ultrasound thing...even at 2 months, a fetus is only about the size of a small rasberry...you aren't able to get ultrasounds like the one you mentioned until the second tri-mester...at which point, I am sure this decision has already been made by the woman carrying to term/ or terminating the pregnancy. Later termination is usually done for health/ emergency reasons...

[Noahma]

Originally Posted by movingtolou

Here's the thing. I have two children...carried them myself. In fact, due to hormonal changes in pregnancy, even had to have a gallbladder removed...Carrying a child for 10 (not 9, as a pregnancy is 40wks) months in in no way a lame 'cop out'. I was never MORE certain of that, until after I did it. It is not JUST about holding a child most of the time so your wife can sleep.

It is just simply a decision that each woman should be empowered to make; women should not be considered 'incubators'... It is not within anyone else's right to make that decision for someone else.

I, for example breastfed both of my children for a year...because research shows it to be beneficial. I would never presume to tell another woman what to do, or judge, or tell her 'she doesn't care about her children' because she's not doing what's best for them; it's her body. The same goes for what you feed your children. I do what works for us.

And on the ultrasound thing...even at 2 months, a fetus is only about the size of a small rasberry...you aren't able to get ultrasounds like the one you mentioned until the second tri-mester...at which point, I am sure this decision has already been made by the woman carrying to term/ or terminating the pregnancy. Later termination is usually done for health/ emergency reasons...

to look at your statement about the second month. Although the little one may be the size of a raspberry, it is QUITE a bit different in terms of what development is happening.

Second Month
At this stage of development the head of the embryo is almost one half of his or her total size. Brain tissues grow rapidly, dividing and becoming a miniature brain that is distinctly human. By 40 days (the sixth week) brain waves can be recorded. Fingers and feet are beginning to develop. Milk teeth form at 61/2 weeks. Facial features, including ears, nose, lips and tongue, form with clarity during this month. Eyes form and darken when pigment is produced around day 35. Eyelids cover the eyes and will soon form a protective seal, reopening during the seventh month. Near the end of the month the skeleton changes from cartilage to bone. Forty muscle sets begin their first exercises and, working with the nervous system, respond with small movements to touch. The baby's blood type is often different from his or her mother's. By eight weeks all body systems are present, and from now on changes will be primarily in size and refinement of body parts already formed. The tiny baby at this stage is called a fetus, Latin for "offspring" or "young one."

much different that the "lump of flesh" that some pro-choice people would have you think.

I also found this of a good read. I know the source is going to become of debate, but look at the credentials of the doctor.
http://nrlc.org/abortion/Fetal_Pain/AnandPainReport.pdf

[movingtolou]

I think most pro-choice people are extremely well educated in the stages of pregnancy...and when a fetus becomes viable. In fact many of those pro-choice people....*gasp*....actually went to medical school. I have said before, I am very pro-child, I love my children...I've made countless sacrafices for them, as many mothers do. I think adoption is a wonderful alternative. I agree, that birth contol options, including abstinence should all be discussed with young people. I still, and always will firmly believe that women should have choice...and again, if you don't agree, and we have differing beliefs about when life/ viability actually begins, that's fine. I'll reiterate, if having an abortion goes against your belief structure, don't have one. I'm fine with that, too...I respect your beliefs. I would never come into your home and impose my values or beliefs on you.

[citigirl]

Using abortion as birth control means that abortion is being used as a back-up method to ineffective or improperly used contraception, or no contraception is being used at all. Of women having abortions,

42% did not use contraception during the month they became pregnant
11% never used a method of birth control
47% have had at least one previous abortion

Although there are situations in which abortion is in response to health concerns of the mother or fetus, or in response to pregnancy arising from abuse, the majority of abortions are obtained for social and financial reasons. The primary reasons given for choosing abortion are given below.

75% say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or other responsibilities

66% say they cannot afford a child

50% do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner


Was this the intent of abortion? Clearly this issue needs to be revisited.

[movingtolou]

Originally Posted by citigirl

Using abortion as birth control means that abortion is being used as a back-up method to ineffective or improperly used contraception, or no contraception is being used at all. Of women having abortions,

42% did not use contraception during the month they became pregnant
11% never used a method of birth control
47% have had at least one previous abortion

Although there are situations in which abortion is in response to health concerns of the mother or fetus, or in response to pregnancy arising from abuse, the majority of abortions are obtained for social and financial reasons. The primary reasons given for choosing abortion are given below.

75% say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or other responsibilities

66% say they cannot afford a child

50% do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner


Was this the intent of abortion? Clearly this issue needs to be revisited.

Where are you getting these statistics from? They are not accurate.

[citigirl]

Originally Posted by movingtolou

Where are you getting these statistics from? They are not accurate.

I posted a link

[movingtolou]

Originally Posted by citigirl

I posted a link

Yes, and the link is to a ANTI-CHOICE web-site.

That is like me posting statistics on 'How Great Sugar is For Your Body'...and using a study provided/ and funded for by The Sugar Companies of America.

[citigirl]

Originally Posted by movingtolou

Yes, and the link is to a ANTI-CHOICE web-site.

That is like me posting statistics on 'How Great Sugar is For Your Body'...and using a study provided/ and funded for by The Sugar Companies of America.

The pro-abortion crowd will try to discredit any statistics that tells the truth about abortion. That is why this unbiased movie is important. Having worked in the restaurant business for 30 years every woman I knew that had an abortion did so for one reason only, they got caught and didn't want to have the child. No rape, no incest, no health reasons. I also knew a few that had multiple abortions.


Planned Parenthood is about money. Lots of money. Your money. As a not-for-profit corporation, income for the national office and affiliates totaled $810 million dollars for the year ending June 30, 2004.4 One third of this amount came from you, the taxpayer. Another third came from clinic activities, and one fourth came from private donors. The least expensive abortions listed by Planned Parenthood cost $350 to $700.5 Using the average of these rates and the number of abortions performed, income from abortions in one year alone could have been as high as $128,000,000.



Facts on Induced Abortion in the United States

On average, women give four reasons for choosing abortion. Three-fourths of women cite concern for or responsibility to other individuals; three-fourths say they cannot afford a child; three-fourths say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or the ability to care for dependents; and half say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner.