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Old 11-07-2012, 06:05 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,955 posts, read 22,271,168 times
Reputation: 9066

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Not here. Just about the wholes state went "blue", big city or not big city. Ditto for most of the rest of New England.
MA is pretty much wall to wall cities and suburban sprawl. Too many people in too little area. Those sorts of areas always go blue, probably because living in cities dulls the mind (for reference: How the city hurts your brain - The Boston Globe ).

 
Old 11-07-2012, 06:07 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,955 posts, read 22,271,168 times
Reputation: 9066
Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
Why is Denmark such a great country with a lower national debt than we have? Why is Finland doing so well? Why is the economy of Brazil suddenly taking off?

If laissez fair economics are so great, why is Somalia not a paradise? Why is there so much poverty in Hong Kong?

Hong Kong's poorest living in 'coffin homes' - CNN.com

The USSR was communism, not social-democracy. Greece had a problem with tax cheats like Romney not paying their share. End of story.
You can fit a country like Denmark in a single U.S. state and have room to spare. The U.S. is vast and you just can't manage a country so large as efficiently as a tiny place like Denmark.

Somalia involves history.
 
Old 11-07-2012, 06:21 PM
 
6,342 posts, read 8,746,879 times
Reputation: 3449
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
You can fit a country like Denmark in a single U.S. state and have room to spare. The U.S. is vast and you just can't manage a country so large as efficiently as a tiny place like Denmark.

Somalia involves history.

Brazil is almost as big as the US, yet when the leftists came in and De Silva began turning the country into a Social-Democracy, their economy took off and people finally got out of poverty.

Bolsa Família - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fome Zero - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 11-07-2012, 07:23 PM
 
801 posts, read 395,632 times
Reputation: 697
Quote:
Originally Posted by djacques View Post
That's why the last two Super Bowls were between blue state teams?
A majority of the NFL players come from colleges in red states though. If all the players on the team actually grew up in lefty places like New England and New York they wouldn't have gotten even close to the Super Bowl. They probably would have never taken sports as seriously and instead of being elite athletes would grow up to be hipsters sipping their french vanilla latte while drawing flowers in their sketchbook and thinking about how "enlightened" they are.
 
Old 11-07-2012, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Area 51.5
13,904 posts, read 11,481,039 times
Reputation: 9075
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
We`ll get out of the war business.
Yet war was waged on the great blue state/city of NY.

Have fun with that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimrob1 View Post
I've always wondered why some of these red states don't pack up and leave. I don't know if there is some law that forbids them breaking away from the USA or what. Its never been done, but perhaps some states would be happier on thier own and leave. Sort of like someone that is unhappy where they live for whatever reasons and relocates.

.
Why didn't you leave when W was president for 8 years?
 
Old 11-07-2012, 07:50 PM
 
Location: The land of infinite variety!
2,050 posts, read 1,233,713 times
Reputation: 4571
Red states can now FEEL FREE TO SECEDE

If they did, I think they'd find that much of that food stamp problem they are always carping about would be their baby in their new nation. Most of the red states average incomes are far below the poverty level that determines who qualifies for gov't assistance.
 
Old 11-07-2012, 08:03 PM
 
245 posts, read 334,378 times
Reputation: 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
Why is Denmark such a great country with a lower national debt than we have? Why is Finland doing so well? Why is the economy of Brazil suddenly taking off?

If laissez fair economics are so great, why is Somalia not a paradise? Why is there so much poverty in Hong Kong?

Hong Kong's poorest living in 'coffin homes' - CNN.com

The USSR was communism, not social-democracy. Greece had a problem with tax cheats like Romney not paying their share. End of story.

Socialism seems to work better in small countries of one culture. They are similar people and I think they feel more like one family member helping another. In the US it's more about class envy and working the system. We were also built of individualism. If you came to America 50+ yrs ago, you better be able to do for yourself and they did. Now we have an open boarder and multiculturalism. I don't blame Americans for not wanting to pay higher taxes to help support 3rd world immigrants. Even if you wanted that to happen, it's just not possible. The gov has to take from the productive to give to the unproductive and nice try passing higher taxes to cover that.
 
Old 11-07-2012, 08:41 PM
 
6,342 posts, read 8,746,879 times
Reputation: 3449
Quote:
Originally Posted by LePew View Post
Socialism seems to work better in small countries of one culture. They are similar people and I think they feel more like one family member helping another. In the US it's more about class envy and working the system. We were also built of individualism. If you came to America 50+ yrs ago, you better be able to do for yourself and they did. Now we have an open boarder and multiculturalism. I don't blame Americans for not wanting to pay higher taxes to help support 3rd world immigrants. Even if you wanted that to happen, it's just not possible. The gov has to take from the productive to give to the unproductive and nice try passing higher taxes to cover that.

Or, maybe we could just cut off the biggest welfare queen of all?

Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

U.S. Foreign Aid Summary

And socialism is working in super huge Brazil, while small government economics failed Somalia and Hong Kong.

But yes, I do support a 30-40% tax rate, with a 50% tax rate on the highest earners, plus a tax on all money sent to foreign banks. And, we could do away with all private insurance and just give everyone a 5% tax on their income and capital gains that will go into a state healthcare system, like they do in Chile and most other countries. Companies would no longer have to buy insurance for their employees and they would save money, and everyone would have healthcare.

We should also tax things that are bad for society, like cigarets, drugs (but make them legal) and fast food (chains, small businesses are okay) We should have no taxes, sales or otherwise on organic foods, birth control, books, and certain "green" goods, i.e., things that are good for society.

Yep, I am a psycho-socialist blue stater, and guess what? THERE ARE A LOT MORE OF ME OUT THERE
 
Old 11-07-2012, 11:02 PM
 
Location: 406
1,423 posts, read 1,542,433 times
Reputation: 1407
Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
Let me say this (maybe it deserves its own thread) we as a "nation" were NEVER UNITED TO BEGIN WITH! New England and the South had little in common during the Revolution and they only united to fight a common enemy (the British) The Constitution only came into being after some rebellions (like Shay's) and the Articles of Confederation were thrown out. Then the Civil War, the Civil Rights movement with the federal government sending soldiers into the South to instill order etc.

Look at the history and face the truth: WE HAVE NEVER BEEN THIS GREAT UNITED NATION PEOPLE SAY WE ARE. WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN UNITED ONLY BY A SHARED GOVERNMENT.
So hold on a minute: wasn't it you, along with callmemaybe, who was preaching the seccesion of WA and OR from the rest of the U.S., what, like three months ago? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but if I'm not, this "throw out the Bible-Belt" sure is a sudden change of course on your part.

Anyway, please recall that, following the failure of the Articles of Confederation, the U.S. constitution (a legal document that is fundamentally libertarian in nature) was adopted by every state legislature from Georgia to New Hampshire (excluding the Republic of Vermont, which followed suit four years later).

Despite the regional differences (which weren't nearly as deep pre-Civil War, of course), all 13 states ratified what was nothing if not a common morality that has been accepted by every territory/republic that has accepted statehood since.

Disunity has, of course, been a fact of U.S. history in various times for sure; however, who would've characterized the U.S. as socio-culturally/socio-politically divided in, say, 1936, 1964 or 1984? To suggest that the divisiveness we see in the year 2012 is a fact of history that encompasses every time/era/place in U.S. history is simply absurd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
Here in Washington we are a left of center state which goes more and more to the left every year. Here in Washington, socialists like me (there, I said it) are not out of the ordinary. We have NOTHING IN COMMON with Alabama, Mississippi and the like.
Well I appreciate your honesty, but I'm curious: do you, a self-admitted socialist (or social democrat, whatever) who, from what I gather, voted for President Obama, believe that he's exemplary of a socialist/social democrat in any significant way?

As for the state of Washington, I'm not sure I can buy that it's as socialist-oriented as you're claiming (i.e. "I AM THE MAJORITY"). While WA has, of course, been a reliably blue state in every presidential election since swinging for Dukakis in 88', it seems to largely be the uber-leftist urban settings of Seattle, Tacoma, Olympia, etc., that manage to offset the political influence of the East, especially in recent (and very close-called) gubernatorial and U.S. Senate elections. I find it intuitively hard to believe that hard-left Democrats prevail in WA because at least 51% of you are socialists (perhaps you can prove this?).

But anyway, in the year 2012 I think that regional divisions are truer and more blatant than ever before, at least in terms of national geopolitics--by no means do I disagree that states like WA and OR are different (to say the least) from states like Georgia and Kentucky. If we respected more of our constitutional guidelines pertaining to federal-state relationships, this wouldn't, in my opinion, have to be such a bad thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
If the Southern Redneck states can't get their act together and stop telling us in Blue America how to live, we should just go our separate ways and be done with it.
I would be interested in learning precisely how it is that "Southern Redneck states" are, apparently, exerting control over the internal affairs of blue states like WA (if that were true, then how is it that the PACNW and the SE are so politically divergent?).

You see, I live in a state that is geographically quite close to WA and probably has more in common with it than it does any state in the Bible Belt, but guess what? I don't want Washington's congressional delegation dictating the way that we in my state live. I struggle to imagine someone like Patty Murray or Christine Gregoire being elected to any statewide office in, or national office from, the state of MT (except for, oddly enough, the state Supreme Court ).

Quote:
Originally Posted by victorianpunk View Post
I am a gay friendly, pro-abortion, pro-marijuana, anti-war, pro-socialized healthcare, pro-strong environmental regulation, pro-across the board amnesty, pro-separation of church and state and pro-Scandinavian style Social-Democracy man and in my home state, I AM THE MAJORITY. And I will no longer apologize for my views and more of us will no longer sit quietly.
Well good--you support drug liberalization, choice in reproduction, marriage equality and a universal healthcare system (although hopefully not a Canadian-style system...); not only do many Washingtonians agree with you, but so do lots of other Americans-at-large. Why do you (along with so many of your ideological compatriots from other left-wing U.S. states) insist on emphasising these issues as what does/must fragment the country?

But I really should end on a more positive note and say that I'm quite pleased with the preferences of WA voters regarding the liberalization of drug and marriage laws--very nice!

Last edited by Montguy; 11-07-2012 at 11:35 PM..
 
Old 11-08-2012, 12:03 AM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
12,334 posts, read 10,313,168 times
Reputation: 5400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wambatown81 View Post
A majority of the NFL players come from colleges in red states though. If all the players on the team actually grew up in lefty places like New England and New York they wouldn't have gotten even close to the Super Bowl. They probably would have never taken sports as seriously and instead of being elite athletes would grow up to be hipsters sipping their french vanilla latte while drawing flowers in their sketchbook and thinking about how "enlightened" they are.

Watching the NFL this past weekend I had to chuckle. A player was injured on the field and both teams players gathered together into a huddle to "pray" for the injured player. I thought to myself, how stupid and rediculous, like some magic words are going to help the guy. Europeans seeing this would just shake their heads in dumbfoundedness. I despise religion, and because of that, I also see the South as the most backward place in the entire country. Shove your religion where the sun don't shine.
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