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Old 11-11-2012, 09:07 PM
 
Location: Limbo
6,475 posts, read 6,187,976 times
Reputation: 6239

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Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
Can you prove that the "takers" outnumber productive people? And how do you measure "taker" and "productive person"?
You overstepped your bounds by asking for scientific data.

I suggest you quit now.
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Old 11-11-2012, 09:07 PM
 
39,277 posts, read 20,371,115 times
Reputation: 12761
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
Can you prove that the "takers" outnumber productive people?
Takers and losers? And who won by popular vote?
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Old 11-11-2012, 09:12 PM
Status: "I hate living in Georgia!!" (set 14 days ago)
 
48,217 posts, read 45,506,708 times
Reputation: 15344
Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee squared View Post
You overstepped your bounds by asking for scientific data.

I suggest you quit now.
Yep, I know what you mean.
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Old 11-11-2012, 09:16 PM
Status: "I hate living in Georgia!!" (set 14 days ago)
 
48,217 posts, read 45,506,708 times
Reputation: 15344
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751 View Post
Who won by popular vote?
President Obama got the popular vote. What is that suppose to mean? What evidence is there that the majority of people who voted for President Obama are "takers"? I need actually empirical data.
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Old 11-11-2012, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
5,302 posts, read 4,404,069 times
Reputation: 5698
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
Wow, gotta love those lib-colored glasses.

Wasn't it liberals that threatened all sorts of horrible things if the election was "stolen" from Obama? Talk about bullying. I know, you libs only see bullying when it's not YOU doing the bullying.
I have to laugh when those who contribute NOTHING call those who pay their bills "bullies."
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Old 11-11-2012, 09:27 PM
 
48,516 posts, read 83,955,483 times
Reputation: 18050
For some no governamnt is better than any governemnt.Nothighappened the last two years really.Can spend any money on what you can't pass.
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Old 11-11-2012, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
5,302 posts, read 4,404,069 times
Reputation: 5698
Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzyTallGuy View Post
I'm sure the police officers, firefighters, EMT folks, people who maintain the streets and roads in your community, national weather service, FAA, health inspectors, and all our soldiers, sailors, marines and air foirce personnel and intelligence operators who put their lives on the line every damn day really appreciate a guy like you.

Ungrateful people like you are absolutely digusting and you don't deserve the public employees that often work hard and even put their lives on the line so that you can sit at your godd*mn keyboard and ***** about "gubmint".
You won't listen, but I was a liberal Democrat in college too, and even then I wanted to learn what others had discovered. I pay a fortune to local government, state government, and the federal government, and therefore I have every right to tell others what I learned. Here is what I experienced living in the world for the last 30 years:

I have had my house robbed several times (once when I found out the name of the perpetrator and gave it to the police); had a car stolen and stripped/burned; and been "ripped off" by dishonest businessmen more than once--have the police (or any government agency) EVER DONE ANYTHING about those instances? No. When I investigated my home's break-in, and asked around the neighborhood, the local kids were happy to give up the perpetrator (a juve delinquent). I report it to the cops, and guess what? "We can't touch kids, even if we caught him in your house." Furthermore, we were threatened not to "take the law into our own hands." Consequently the same delinquent continued robbing houses until we moved away, with the full knowledge and consent of the police department.

Firefighters? We had a volunteer fire department that did just fine here in NH long ago, without any cost to the local taxpayer. Over 4 homes and 30 years I have never had a fire because I minimize fire risk and of course don't smoke. Currently I do pay an extreme amount in local property taxes so that firefighters can work two days a week for 20 years and then retire with $50,000 pensions.

And you forgot that I should be grateful for trash disposal services, to which I reply I pay for directly, by a $2 per bag fee and not property taxes.

EMT? They are private here. I pay for them if I need them, which I haven't yet.

Those who maintain roads and streets? Again, pay a fortune in property taxes, and have a 4WD anyway. And again, we had excellent road and street maintenance and snow removal 30 years ago, when property taxes here were about 1/8th of what they are today.

National weather service? There are many internet sites that monitor weather without government subsidy. In any case, knowing a storm is coming doesn't change anything for me.

FAA? Again, private industry (airports and airlines) has a vested interest in not letting planes crash, and I really doubt government oversight changes anything. Maybe this is because I work in a heavily government regulated industry, and my current job involves dealing with government oversight for a large corporation: without exception, the only way our government overseers know there is a problem is because we have already identified it and taken steps to deal with it.

Health inspectors? Again, in America, private industry tries to prevent problems because they can be sued; if there ARE problems, then we don't know until people get sick. Then, private industry deals with them; if they didn't they'd be sued and out of business. May I mention here that it is impossible to control the safety of food when we have "Free Trade" from Mexico, and it is our government that facilitated our grocery shelves be filled with fruits and veggies from places that use human waste as fertilizer.

The military? Been there (Navy), served 5 years, and never disrespected anyone IN the military. Mllitary servicemen and women are the best the nation has to offer, and they are treated with absolute distain by the military establishment. They are paid virtually nothing, worked to death, treated like slaves, nickel and dimed for things that should be paid for (like moving to the next duty station), and risk being killed by moronic commanders that don't even get a slap on the wrist. It is the most stressful life imaginable, and the military establishment makes it a thousand times worse than it needs to be, for both the serviceperson and the family (who also are required to serve the military, pay-free). When we were in the military (5 years when every penny went to surviving), our captain had a slush fund that WE paid for; he used it for "gifts" to higher-up military officials. We were told if we tried to object in any way (like reporting it to the chaplain), our work hours would be 22 hours a day, 7 days a week for the 4 months out of the year we were home (work days are 24/7 when deployed). Politicians decide to wage wars simply to stoke their own egos and empire-build, and servicemen die. So I continue to believe that the military establishment (as a branch of government) is one of the biggest evils on the planet.

After those nightmare military years, I spent 10 years working for local government, then for HUD. The incredible corruption I saw in those jobs, and the absolute distain for the taxpayer, was so sickening that I walked away from the high pay and benefits. I actually administered a new tax program that hit anyone getting or refinancing a mortgage (it cost me $700 when I bought my under-$100,000 house, and another $600 when refinancing), with the proceeds given away to help with housing costs in $5,000 increments to anyone who met low income criteria. I can tell you that with millions eventually given away, only ONE person actually needed the money and deserved it: and this person refused to take more than $750 to repair her roof; AND she repaid the money when she had no obligation to do so. The others? They lied on their applications about the other public assistance they received; not a single one of them worked but somehow they had plenty of money for lots of gold jewelry and cars far better than mine; and they all belonged to a clique that did nothing but keep up on the "freebies" from government and apply for them all.

I am firmly convinced that ANYONE, no matter how liberal, would be disgusted with government at all levels if they had personally experienced the things I did.
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Old 11-11-2012, 10:52 PM
 
Location: west mich
5,740 posts, read 5,868,596 times
Reputation: 2120
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Conservatives need to face certain realities: it isn't just Obama, it's the American people. This country has lost it. We need a new survival paradigm.

Perhaps we should take our cues from Old World conservatives, who have survived for generations as a defeated but vigorous minority in countries dominated by leftism.

Because that's what it's about today: not victory, but survival.

We can take heart in that a traditionalist sub-culture exists in America with its own movements and institutions. But Obama could put a big dent in those institutions. If push comes to shove and the Obama administration doesn't back down, many of these institutions could be forced into bankruptcy by non-compliance fines. So much for sending your children to one of the many small, orthodox, Catholic liberal arts colleges in the country. So much for a career in healthcare or social work at a religious hospital or charity. All such venues may be forced to either close or be corrupted under Obamacare. Already in California state mandates have placed the profession of teaching in public schools out of reach for serious Christians. And the list goes on ...

In the United States it's not going to be violent, bloody martyrdom or anything. Not anytime soon. But it does seem that we are on a trajectory of gradually excluding Christians from public life in various ways. With the state mandating that certain jobs and activities openly facilitate evil, we are faced with either treason to our faith or retreat from society. The underground.

Well, European conservatives - and they do exist - have lived under such conditions for a long time. I suggest we find out how they have managed, what they have done to survive, and how they navigate the moral and spiritual minefield of their respective societies. It's about survival now.
My, what paranoia.
America - a sea of leftism, and you can't worship as you please?
You must live "underground" because......why?
Christians under attack because they aren't running government?
Your freedom in jeopardy because Christianity is not taught in public schools?
Obama the Christian, wants to take away your freedom of worship?
The government anti-Christian?
Are these your points? you're really not very clear.
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Old 11-12-2012, 04:41 AM
 
2,179 posts, read 6,616,692 times
Reputation: 1676
I think america is on the same path that greece has taken
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Old 11-12-2012, 04:46 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,482 posts, read 8,839,940 times
Reputation: 2527
Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee squared View Post
Not liberals in general, but to me, at least.

I'm sure there are more.
People should not think life is sacred where did they get that from
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