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Old 01-27-2013, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,153 posts, read 11,423,328 times
Reputation: 4284

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
One would think that people would look to things that might actually have an impact on crime. It was noted that the AWB might not do a darn thing as these guns were rarely used to commit a crime, but it made a bunch of people feel good.

After all, that's what it's all about. Making yourself feel better about yourself I suppose.
Gun crime did go down after a peak in 1994. The argument the other poster used was simply that there have been no conclusive evidence to back up the claim that the 1994 AWB was the reason for it.

nice deflection though
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:41 PM
 
77,567 posts, read 33,038,709 times
Reputation: 15435
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
Gun crime did go down after a peak in 1994. The argument the other poster used was simply that there have been no conclusive evidence to back up the claim that the 1994 AWB was the reason for it.

nice deflection though
I didn't bring up the fact that those who passed the law admitted that it very well may not have any impact on crime. Being that the rates did not go up when the law expired would tend to prove them right.

So, if you believed it would likely not actually address the issue, why bother? Why would you not look to things that might actually address the problem?
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:57 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,542,844 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
Gun crime did go down after a peak in 1994. The argument the other poster used was simply that there have been no conclusive evidence to back up the claim that the 1994 AWB was the reason for it.

nice deflection though
Gun crime didn't peak in 94. What would give you that impression? Violent crime and homicide was already on a downward trend when the AWB was put into place, but the AWB had no effect on crime because criminals don't use rifles. The gun of choice is a cheap concealable handgun and that goes for mass shooters as well.
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:08 PM
 
7,315 posts, read 5,504,766 times
Reputation: 2837
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwruckman View Post
You have left out one thing, these paradises on Earth are also places you can run around and say its all God's will. Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition, All Praise be Upon HIM.
Yup. If they shoot someone, it's God's will, if women are raped, it's God's will. Scary places indeed.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:12 PM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,153 posts, read 11,423,328 times
Reputation: 4284
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
I didn't bring up the fact that those who passed the law admitted that it very well may not have any impact on crime. Being that the rates did not go up when the law expired would tend to prove them right.

So, if you believed it would likely not actually address the issue, why bother? Why would you not look to things that might actually address the problem?
idk who brought it up, thats not the point, the point is that the person who did bring it up was arguing something that was irrelevant, which i already explained. The ban did what it was created for, the problem is, you have continued to claim it didnt based on claiming it didnt do something it was never meant to do. How hard is that to understand for you ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
Gun crime didn't peak in 94. What would give you that impression? Violent crime and homicide was already on a downward trend when the AWB was put into place, but the AWB had no effect on crime because criminals don't use rifles. The gun of choice is a cheap concealable handgun and that goes for mass shooters as well.

Gun violence per capita, did peak in 1994. I believe i believe i linked an article a couple of pages back that talked about it that even included charts.

And did you really just say criminals dont use rifles ????? You cant be serious ????
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:35 PM
 
77,567 posts, read 33,038,709 times
Reputation: 15435
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
idk who brought it up, thats not the point, the point is that the person who did bring it up was arguing something that was irrelevant, which i already explained. The ban did what it was created for, the problem is, you have continued to claim it didnt based on claiming it didnt do something it was never meant to do. How hard is that to understand for you ?
Perhaps you need to re-read what I said. I said clearly that it was stated that it might not do a darn thing and then I asked why it would not be better to do something that would address the problem?
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:57 PM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,542,844 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
idk who brought it up, thats not the point, the point is that the person who did bring it up was arguing something that was irrelevant, which i already explained. The ban did what it was created for, the problem is, you have continued to claim it didnt based on claiming it didnt do something it was never meant to do. How hard is that to understand for you ?


FBI — Expanded Homicide Data Table 8




Gun violence per capita, did peak in 1994. I believe i believe i linked an article a couple of pages back that talked about it that even included charts.

And did you really just say criminals dont use rifles ????? You cant be serious ????
I probably should have clarified to say that criminals overwhelmingly do not like rifles, some will still use rifles, but rifles are still the least preferred weapon.

Total firearms: 8,583
Handguns 6,220
Rifles 323
Shotguns 356
Other guns 97
Firearms, type not stated 1,587
Knives or cutting instruments 1,694
Blunt objects (clubs, hammers, etc.) 496
Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.) 728
FBI — Expanded Homicide Data Table 8

According to the F.B.I. nothing peaked in 1994. Homicide peaked in 1980 at 10.2 per 100,00, Rape peaked in 1992 at 42.8 per 100,000, Robbery peaked in 1991 at 272.7, and assault peaked in 1992 at 441.9 per 100,000.

In 1994 there were 9 homicides per 100K, 39.3 rapes per 100K, 237.8 robberies per 100K, and 427.6 agg assaults per 100K. 1994 didn't even have the most number of anything much less rate, you should double check the article's source because it is far from accurate.

Stats about all US cities - real estate, relocation info, crime, house prices, cost of living, races, home value estimator, recent sales, income, photos, schools, maps, weather, neighborhoods, and more
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:04 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,608 posts, read 9,789,721 times
Reputation: 9236
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
Oh, btw, the US homicide rate is 4.7 and the UK is 1.8 a far cry from your mythical numbers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
California has some of the strictest gun control laws in the U.S., but their homicide rate is the same as the national average.
Homicide is a very specific form of violence. In the U.K., precisely because a gun is so hard to come by, when someone does go through with the effort of obtaining one, he wants you dead. And dead you will likely be. In America a BUNCH of people are dead from guns and there was no murderous intent to it! Guns are so plentiful, and people are so used to having them around, that they kill people in ways that simply do not exist in other parts of the world. Drop a gun and it can kill you or a friend. Your kid can take your gun to school and shoot a playmate. Well more than 1/2 of the gun deaths in America are accidental or some other form of gun violence, besides homicide. Now do you get why America is in the top 10 of 143 countries ranked by gun deaths per 100,000 and the UK is in the bottom 5?? Tell me why this is a good thing.

H
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:16 AM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,542,844 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Homicide is a very specific form of violence. In the U.K., precisely because a gun is so hard to come by, when someone does go through with the effort of obtaining one, he wants you dead. And dead you will likely be. In America a BUNCH of people are dead from guns and there was no murderous intent to it! Guns are so plentiful, and people are so used to having them around, that they kill people in ways that simply do not exist in other parts of the world. Drop a gun and it can kill you or a friend. Your kid can take your gun to school and shoot a playmate. Well more than 1/2 of the gun deaths in America are accidental or some other form of gun violence, besides homicide. Now do you get why America is in the top 10 of 143 countries ranked by gun deaths per 100,000 and the UK is in the bottom 5?? Tell me why this is a good thing.

H
I never said gun violence is a good thing. I said guns are not the problem. We have other underlying causes for the violence.





Elisabeth Fosslien's Gun Charts - Business Insider
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:19 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,608 posts, read 9,789,721 times
Reputation: 9236
Default WARNING: This Post Contains Extremely Graphic Language and Descriptions of Gun Confiscation!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil306 View Post
Uh yes, but I again I ask the question and I am still waiting for an answer: According to The US President, The Vice President, Handgun Control Inc, the anti gun people on this board, including you, you don't want to ban guns. So if you don't want to ban guns, there are still going to be guns. ALOT OF GUNS. In fact, even more guns, because people will buy and buy and buy more, in case another (inevitable) ban of guns comes out.

So if there are still all these guns in this country, how is that going to lessen gun crimes? The guns are still here, still being produced, still being manufactured, still being bought.
Wrong. I do want to ban guns. I am not the President, nor the Vice President. I don't have to uphold the Constitution. As has been stated many times, assault rifles don't factor large where gun violence is concerned. I've never been a "low hanging fruit" kind of guy. I am a "solutions guy" according to my gal. The solution in this case is the Full Monty. European Style firearms lockdown. Would it be easy? As a reason not to do it, the fact that it would be probably the hardest thing America ever had to do besides give up its slaves, the difficulty of a total gun ban is the weakest excuse. We're better than this. And, if we're not, tough, we will be. I guarantee it.

H
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