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Old 02-06-2013, 12:55 AM
 
10,553 posts, read 9,645,339 times
Reputation: 4784

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
There are two problems here. The first is the assumption that the single biggest problem in the U.S. is the government debt and this is then the benchmark of economic success. It isn't.

Second, by 2009, the last year Bush prepared a budget, the debt was $12 trillion. If the debt is now $17 trillion, that is five trillion more.

Third, but the idea that the President is directly responsible for the deficit/debt is patently false. The overall economy, which the President has limited control, dictates spending and revenues. In the Great Recession, revenues fell due to a weak economy and increased spending on the safety net was also due to a weak economy. So, blaming Obama for the economy he largely inherited is pointless.

I really think anyone thinking about posting in this thread should read this column first.
Thank you for posting that.

Can you imagine if the urgent need for adapting to climate change got the same amount of attention as the "debt crisis."

 
Old 02-06-2013, 02:59 AM
 
19,968 posts, read 30,200,655 times
Reputation: 40041
if the stock market is inflated, is it wise to withdraw your 401 k , even with the penalties?



somewhere along the line, the stock market will adjust,,
the politicians are driving us over a cliff,,,,but no one seems to care
 
Old 02-06-2013, 09:47 AM
 
Location: San Diego
5,319 posts, read 8,981,479 times
Reputation: 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
MTA you are priceless.

1. The debt for 2009 (for which Bush is "responsible for"- even though Obama and the democratic congress and senate could have changed it) was $10 trillion, not $12 trillion- nice try with liberal revisionist history. You are very good at that.
Wrong again!! MTA was correct with their number:

Government - Historical Debt Outstanding - Annual 2000 - 2012

Quote:
09/30/2009 11,909,829,003,511.75
And it was Bush's final budget which went from October 2008 - September 2009!

U.S. Senate: Reference Home > Glossary > fiscal year

Quote:
fiscal year - The fiscal year is the accounting period for the federal government which begins on October 1 and ends on September 30. The fiscal year is designated by the calendar year in which it ends; for example, fiscal year 2013 begins on October 1, 2012 and ends on September 30, 2013. Congress passes appropriations legislation to fund the government for every fiscal year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
2. The debt is now $17 trillion, therefore Obama is on the hook for $ 7 trillion ( so far). Obama is on track to be the largest deficit spender in US history. At the end of his second term, he will have doubled the US debt.
Wrong once again! The current debt is 16.5 not 17 trillion.

Nice of you to "pad this number" a bit for an added shock effect!

Debt to the Penny (Daily History Search Application)

Quote:
2/4/2013 16,475,048,398,165.79
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
3. Revenues are at the same level as they were prior to "The Great Recession". Spending levels have increased to create record deficits under Obama.
Revenue levels are WAY down from their previous average (18.3% GDP), but these revenues have gone up in 2012 from 15.4% to 15.8%.

It was Bush who brought revenues all the way down to 15.1% GDP.

United States federal budget - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:
During FY2012, the federal government collected approximately $2.45 trillion in tax revenue, up $147 billion or 6% versus FY2011 revenues of $2.30 trillion. Primary receipt categories included individual income taxes ($1,132B or 47%), Social Security/Social Insurance taxes ($845B or 35%), and corporate taxes ($242B or 10%).[10] Other revenue types included excise, estate and gift taxes. Revenues rose across all categories in FY2012 versus FY2011.
FY2012 revenues were 15.8% GDP, versus 15.4% GDP in FY2011. Tax revenues averaged approximately 18.3% of gross domestic product (GDP) over the 1970-2009 period, generally ranging plus or minus 2% from that level. Tax revenues are significantly affected by the economy. Recessions typically reduce government tax collections as economic activity slows. For example, tax revenues declined from $2.5 trillion in 2008 to $2.1 trillion in 2009, and remained at that level in 2010. From 2008 to 2009, individual income taxes declined 20%, while corporate taxes declined 50%. At 15.1% of GDP, the 2009 and 2010 collections were the lowest level of the past 50 years
 
Old 02-06-2013, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,005 posts, read 47,597,802 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainebrokerman View Post
if the stock market is inflated, is it wise to withdraw your 401 k , even with the penalties?

somewhere along the line, the stock market will adjust,,
the politicians are driving us over a cliff,,,,but no one seems to care
You could always move it to money market fund, or some safer funds. Talk to your investment advisor.
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