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Old 02-07-2013, 01:52 AM
 
33,046 posts, read 22,062,610 times
Reputation: 8970

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
It did lower rents at the time it passed... my Uncle and one of my teachers both supported Prop 13 and both had their rents reduced after it passed...

Rent Control is not Statewide... Prop 13 applies to every assessable property in the State...

Trickle down worked for me...

In high school I worked at specialty auto parts house... I know I benefited from Trickle Down.

Let's face it... no one "Needs" to restore antique or classic cars... many desire to do so and it takes money to make a desire reality...

Tonight's Bay Area news had a segment on the hiring boom in Silicon Valley... it was all about Trickle Down... High Tech has been on a hiring spree which continues to generate new jobs through out the local economy... everything from service to construction... even Home Depot is adding 15,000 jobs in California.

Isn't that a Bad Thing for burger flippers? (You of all people should know where I'm going with this.)

Trickle down did not work for all those renters in California who worked to get local rent controls on the ballot.
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:05 AM
 
66,501 posts, read 30,333,656 times
Reputation: 8671
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
??? In Michigan, the nonhomestead tax on rental property is 18 mills, which works out to approx $1,500 per year on a typical rental house. You say $1,500 per year isn't that much?
No, it's not. Particularly in states where property taxes are really high. It's only $125 per month.
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Old 02-07-2013, 04:48 AM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,193 posts, read 16,632,080 times
Reputation: 8850
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
Dem's believe in trickle down economy of a different type. Instead of trickle down from the rich Dem's want the rich to pay the government ,then have the government trickle it down SO both believe in trickle down, one side believes in trickle down from the wealthy one believes trickle down from the government
There is some truth to that, but in the process, the government extracts a large portion to pay for their bloated agency's employee's salaries, etc. And they also direct money to their supporters.

The fact is, though, that the Federal government prints as much money as it wants today, so there is no shortage to distribute to the "poor". But the effect of this is that the value of the dollar goes down, meaning (to those who don't understand economics) that it buys less, thus making the poor even poorer, because they have to stretch what little income they may have, even further.

There really isn't anything that the Democrats do right. The Democrat Party is a propaganda machine, designed to keep people dependent on government, and thus, keep Democrats in power. When they increase taxes on the so-called "rich" (many of whom are affected by their taxing policies are not really that rich), they hinder the growth of business, and discourage achievement, which depresses the job market further in an already weak economy as we have had for the last four years.

With few jobs available, whatever jobs may be out their are only going to go to the most qualified. Again, this leaves a lot of people still in need. And where do they turn? Why, to government, of course!

An interesting truth was pointed out recently: There are two kinds of "rich." Those who are rich in assets have very little in taxable "earned" income. Therefore they escape the tax increases that are based on "earnings." Those tax increases don't affect them. They are living off their investments, which is taxed differently.

It is really the middle class that are hurt most by the Democrats recent tax increases.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:10 AM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,193 posts, read 16,632,080 times
Reputation: 8850
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
That's not trickle down. Trickle down is the idea that the more wealth at the top, the faster the economy will grow. That's because they assume people will spend that money.

They don't, that's the problem.
You're understanding of "trickle down" is incorrect. It isn't based on an assumption that "people will 'spend' that money." What it means is that a growing, strong economy produces more opportunity (jobs), and it does. This is an undeniable truth.

Your thinking is flawed because you think that they should spend money so that the local hot dog vendor can make some money. But if no one wants hot dogs, how does that help him?

But a thriving economy based on business expansion creates opportunities that make it possible for that hot dog vendor to perhaps open a restaurant. It gets him off the street, and sets him up in a real business, where he has the potential to become more than the hot dog vendor on the street.

It also creates openings for other people to enter the job market and earn a living. It's about jobs.

Business is what drives the economy. Not people spending money. Yes, people spend more when the economy is booming, but that quickly dries up without business expansion.

Right now, there is little or no business expansion, therefor no jobs being created. Therefore, no money to be spent either.

It's all about jobs and business. Period. Money doesn't grow on trees. Wealth must be created.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:16 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,889 posts, read 21,064,600 times
Reputation: 8620
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
You're understanding of "trickle down" is incorrect. It isn't based on an assumption that "people will 'spend' that money." What it means is that a growing, strong economy produces more opportunity (jobs), and it does. This is an undeniable truth.

Your thinking is flawed because you think that they should spend money so that the local hot dog vendor can make some money. But if no one wants hot dogs, how does that help him?

But a thriving economy based on business expansion creates opportunities that make it possible for that hot dog vendor to perhaps open a restaurant. It gets him off the street, and sets him up in a real business, where he has the potential to become more than the hot dog vendor on the street.

It also creates openings for other people to enter the job market and earn a living. It's about jobs.

Business is what drives the economy. Not people spending money. Yes, people spend more when the economy is booming, but that quickly dries up without business expansion.

Right now, there is little or no business expansion, therefor no jobs being created. Therefore, no money to be spent either.

It's all about jobs and business. Period. Money doesn't grow on trees. Wealth must be created.
It is deniable, and easily disproven. Tax rates have been the lowest ever on the top earners, they are making record profits, have been for a decade.

Economy is stagnant.

Trickle down doesn't work.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:17 AM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,595,032 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
You're understanding of "trickle down" is incorrect. It isn't based on an assumption that "people will 'spend' that money." What it means is that a growing, strong economy produces more opportunity (jobs), and it does. This is an undeniable truth.

Your thinking is flawed because you think that they should spend money so that the local hot dog vendor can make some money. But if no one wants hot dogs, how does that help him?

But a thriving economy based on business expansion creates opportunities that make it possible for that hot dog vendor to perhaps open a restaurant. It gets him off the street, and sets him up in a real business, where he has the potential to become more than the hot dog vendor on the street.

It also creates openings for other people to enter the job market and earn a living. It's about jobs.

Business is what drives the economy. Not people spending money. Yes, people spend more when the economy is booming, but that quickly dries up without business expansion.

Right now, there is little or no business expansion, therefor no jobs being created. Therefore, no money to be spent either.

It's all about jobs and business. Period. Money doesn't grow on trees. Wealth must be created.
Where has trickle down economics worked? I haven't personally some across any supportive evidence that would lead me to conclude that TDE works.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:21 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,482 posts, read 8,838,802 times
Reputation: 2527
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
There is some truth to that, but in the process, the government extracts a large portion to pay for their bloated agency's employee's salaries, etc. And they also direct money to their supporters.

The fact is, though, that the Federal government prints as much money as it wants today, so there is no shortage to distribute to the "poor". But the effect of this is that the value of the dollar goes down, meaning (to those who don't understand economics) that it buys less, thus making the poor even poorer, because they have to stretch what little income they may have, even further.

There really isn't anything that the Democrats do right. The Democrat Party is a propaganda machine, designed to keep people dependent on government, and thus, keep Democrats in power. When they increase taxes on the so-called "rich" (many of whom are affected by their taxing policies are not really that rich), they hinder the growth of business, and discourage achievement, which depresses the job market further in an already weak economy as we have had for the last four years.

With few jobs available, whatever jobs may be out their are only going to go to the most qualified. Again, this leaves a lot of people still in need. And where do they turn? Why, to government, of course!

An interesting truth was pointed out recently: There are two kinds of "rich." Those who are rich in assets have very little in taxable "earned" income. Therefore they escape the tax increases that are based on "earnings." Those tax increases don't affect them. They are living off their investments, which is taxed differently.

It is really the middle class that are hurt most by the Democrats recent tax increases.
Inflation is coming also
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:24 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,482 posts, read 8,838,802 times
Reputation: 2527
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
It is deniable, and easily disproven. Tax rates have been the lowest ever on the top earners, they are making record profits, have been for a decade.

Economy is stagnant.

Trickle down doesn't work.
Obamas trickle down from the governemnt certainly has not worked
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:32 AM
 
11,780 posts, read 8,595,032 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
Obamas trickle down from the governemnt certainly has not worked
That's arguable though, most reputable economists claim that there wasn't enough of a stimulus from Obama - when $15T in wealth disappears it's going to take time to build it back up. Then again, some of the stimulus programs were absolutely horrible.

These same economists warned us years ago that the Bush tax cuts would create an unsustainable debt load if they were not coupled with cuts in government spending, so it might be wise to at least hear them out.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:39 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,889 posts, read 21,064,600 times
Reputation: 8620
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
Obamas trickle down from the governemnt certainly has not worked
He had the lowest tax rates on the top earners in history until this Jan. That's trickle down.

Can we stop this asinine idea that he has redistributed wealth? I think the Obama administration has been awful on the economy. We should have cut defense more, spent less, tie more restrictions to wall street banks, the list goes on and on.

But he hasn't taxed any higher, in fact less then the bush administration, until this year, and the tax increases were miniscule.

I know we can't tax our way out of this, cuts are needed, both sides are to blame for not cutting in a way acceptable to the American voter, so they just keep spending.

But trickle down doesn't work. Every economic model proves this.

What works? Expanding the middle class. Could mean government middle class jobs, could be allowing the economy to grow while capping spending to inspire investment.
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