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Old 02-22-2013, 09:31 AM
 
14,292 posts, read 9,676,201 times
Reputation: 4254

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
If a fetus is not a life, why does the court wage 2 counts of intoxication manslaughter when a pregnant woman is killed by a drunk driver?

No one can seem to answer this elementary question. Only one person has babbled on and on about nothing relevant.
Simple, the courts have twisted the law to say that a fetus is not a person, per se. They have decided that the fetus is the property of the mother, and the discretion is left up to the mother whether the fetus is life or not. If the mother says it's a lump of cells, you can kill it, if she says it's her baby, then it's alive.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:52 AM
 
20,458 posts, read 12,378,099 times
Reputation: 10251
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saritaschihuahua View Post
That's what the "pro-life" movement would love more than anything - to make it appear as if the religion was not behind the movement. A little too late for that!

well one thing is for certain, defending the sanctity of killing the unborn has risen to religious ferver from your side.

This really is simple. Protect the innocent.

move along.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:56 AM
 
Location: CHicago, United States
6,933 posts, read 8,492,393 times
Reputation: 3510
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redstate1122 View Post
Not all social conservatives are young-earth creationists. And what does abortion have to do with "owning" your body. I'm personally pro-choice but it stems from an acknowledgement of personhood and when it begins. If you believe it begins at conception, the issue isn't a woman "owning" her body it's the unborn child not having the right to own theirs.
The decision to have an abortion should not always and all situations solely be the decision by a woman. In most instances, the "other half", the man, should have a say. I'm not an abortion supporter, though, but have thought in the case of rape, incest and the threatened life of the Mother than an abortion should be allowed. But I still have difficulty making an exception. If it were the law, only an abortion with those exceptions ... it's something I could support strongly. I believe too many women wrongfully use abortion as a convenience in their lives.
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Old 02-22-2013, 10:35 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,203,370 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
Not quite. One problem with the frequent "forcing a woman to remain pregnant is like forcing someone to donate a kidney to support someone else" which your argument is a variation of, is that whereas your dialysis tech didn't cause the diabetes the dialysis is treating, the woman in question caused the fetus to exist through her own willful actions.

Even if the woman didn't intend to get pregnant, birth control is not 100% effective. You engage in sex knowing that pregnancy might occur. This is the justification used for forcing men to pay child support for children they didn't want. He consents to the child support through the act of having sex. A woman knows that pregnancy might occur when she has sex, and a woman knows that gestation occurs within her body. Pregnancy is not something which has been done to her unwillingly therefore the "you can't force someone to use their body unwillingly to support another person" is a failed argument. It ignores implied consent.
I can invite someone into my home, but I can also evict them. So invitation is not a requirement to continue residence on my property. My body is my property. No one is allowed to live in my body, or have use of my organs without my permission, and I have the right to evict anyone living in my body, or using my organs at any time.
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Old 02-22-2013, 10:50 AM
 
7,300 posts, read 6,731,683 times
Reputation: 2916
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
You made the claim u prove it you have fingers don't you
I've already told you. I don't do your research for you, or any other right winger. Now, if you were a leftie, whole different story. I do go out of my way for lefties. They're worth it.

I'll tell you what, since you're so needy, why don't you present your searches to me and I'll tell you if you did it right or not? See? Even though you're a right winger, I'm willing to help you out here.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:48 AM
 
7,359 posts, read 5,462,301 times
Reputation: 3142
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
I can invite someone into my home, but I can also evict them. So invitation is not a requirement to continue residence on my property. My body is my property. No one is allowed to live in my body, or have use of my organs without my permission, and I have the right to evict anyone living in my body, or using my organs at any time.
A child is not an invited guest. You are not responsible for guests but you are responsible for children. Parents do not have the option to evict their children. Once you have accepted becoming a parent, you are indeed committed to it.

All of the arguments which revolve around civil rights must necessarily presuppose the fetus is a human being. After all, as in your argument, in order to evict someone, there must be someone you're evicting. Once you've accepted it as a person, the fetus becomes the child of the pregnant woman, whether it is born or not. Society accepts special responsibilities and relationships between parents and children. Note that I'm not saying a fetus is actually a person, but I'm saying that's a whole separate debate.

Parents have a duty to support and care for their children which they do not have with any other member of society. And while they don't have a duty to donate organs and such to their children, we've already covered that ground as regards pregnancy with the implied consent via engaging in the sex in the first place.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:50 AM
 
7,359 posts, read 5,462,301 times
Reputation: 3142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saritaschihuahua View Post
I've already told you. I don't do your research for you, or any other right winger. Now, if you were a leftie, whole different story. I do go out of my way for lefties. They're worth it.

I'll tell you what, since you're so needy, why don't you present your searches to me and I'll tell you if you did it right or not? See? Even though you're a right winger, I'm willing to help you out here.
All you're doing is defeating your own argument by refusing to support them. Your characterization of it as doing research for right wingers when they ask you to prove your own points is transparently false.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,203,370 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
A child is not an invited guest. You are not responsible for guests but you are responsible for children. Parents do not have the option to evict their children. Once you have accepted becoming a parent, you are indeed committed to it.

All of the arguments which revolve around civil rights must necessarily presuppose the fetus is a human being. After all, as in your argument, in order to evict someone, there must be someone you're evicting. Once you've accepted it as a person, the fetus becomes the child of the pregnant woman, whether it is born or not. Society accepts special responsibilities and relationships between parents and children. Note that I'm not saying a fetus is actually a person, but I'm saying that's a whole separate debate.

Parents have a duty to support and care for their children which they do not have with any other member of society. And while they don't have a duty to donate organs and such to their children, we've already covered that ground as regards pregnancy with the implied consent via engaging in the sex in the first place.
I don't consider a fetus a person. But since you seem to, how do you ensure every pregnant woman gives birth? Do you charge a woman not eating properly, drinking, smoking, or doing drugs with child endangerment? Will all miscarriages be investigated to ensure no foul play was involved? If I slip and fall and miscarry, will I be charged with negligence, or homicide? How will you even know when a woman is pregnant? If you are found to have had an abortion do you go to prison? If I am raped can I have an
abortion? If I might die can I get an abortion?
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Old 02-22-2013, 12:19 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 6,731,683 times
Reputation: 2916
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
A child is not an invited guest. You are not responsible for guests but you are responsible for children. Parents do not have the option to evict their children. Once you have accepted becoming a parent, you are indeed committed to it.

All of the arguments which revolve around civil rights must necessarily presuppose the fetus is a human being. After all, as in your argument, in order to evict someone, there must be someone you're evicting. Once you've accepted it as a person, the fetus becomes the child of the pregnant woman, whether it is born or not. Society accepts special responsibilities and relationships between parents and children. Note that I'm not saying a fetus is actually a person, but I'm saying that's a whole separate debate.

Parents have a duty to support and care for their children which they do not have with any other member of society. And while they don't have a duty to donate organs and such to their children, we've already covered that ground as regards pregnancy with the implied consent via engaging in the sex in the first place.
Oh, did nature and evolution put the batch of cells outside our bodies where you can pass judgment on it? No, right? It's inside OUR UTERUSES. Well, too bad so sad, screw all you nosey fascist a-hs. If it's inside our bodies, it either must be a mistake of evolution, or it was intended that the female have full control of that batch of cells. My gallbladder is mine, my appendix is mine, my liver is mine, and if I have a clump of cells in MY uterus, you bet your _ss it's my batch of cells to do with as I desire. Go change evolutionary processes if these bother you so damned much. Good luck with that, by the way! Now get thee to church. That's the only reason you're obsessed by batches of cells. I don't believe you give a sh_t about any sort of life, frankly.

The more I listen to these "pro-lifers" the more I'm beginning to believe there is a Satan, and they're IT.
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Old 02-22-2013, 02:15 PM
 
607 posts, read 855,836 times
Reputation: 378
More GOP bigots. Anyone care to defend this?

House Republicans Strip Protections From LGBT Victims In New Violence Against Women Act | ThinkProgress

Quote:
The House GOP bill entirely leaves out provisions aimed at helping LGBT victims of domestic violence. Specifically, the bill removes “sexual orientation” and “gender identity” from the list of underserved populations who face barriers to accessing victim services, thereby disqualifying LGBT victims from a related grant program.
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