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I take issue with his belief in American exceptionalism. This is what many American people may believe, but not true for other cultures outside of the U.S. It is his opinion, and not a fact, but he presents his statements like they are facts. That is a sign of brainwashing.
If you take issue with his beliefs, challenge them. Just as others have been challenging you on this thread. Your remark was offensive. Deliberately so.
Never heard this view that interracial marriages makes one more enlightened. That's news to me. Maybe in some circles in western Europe, but certainly not here in the US or Latin America.
I was trying to understand, why people in the U.S. view interracial relationships as social progression? If a couple from different ethnic backgrounds and religions wed, so bet it, but should this be held up as a great deed? This is odd to me and no I do not understand it.
Ethnic herding as you say, is a way of life for many cultures. You are incorrect to believe that only your way is the right way. There are many different types of people with different views.
If you really believed in Freedom, you would respect other views, correct?
Not correct. It would never be correct to respect irrational views, no matter who holds them. Ethnic herding is objectively a terrible way of life that needs to be changed for all.
Not changed by us through physical force or domination, but by showing by example why it is flawed and illogical. Ethnic herding is a way of life that inevitably leads to other irrationalities, such as ethnic wars and ethnic "cleansing". But, that is a simple consequence of its inherent irrationality.
Ethnic identity is bad, both conceptually and empirically. In other words, in theory as well as practice. Humans are too good to behave in this sordid fashion.
Imagine the utter folly of it: One group of humans observe that other humans bounce light off their skin at a different wavelength and proceed to make judgements about those people, and even kill them in many thousands of cases that have littered history.
Then imagine a country that proclaims that individuals are free and have rights. And that those rights are not dependent on silly characteristics such as race or sex. What happens in such a society? What has happened here in America. The decline of the herd, elevation of the individual, and a better way of life for all.
Ethnic herding is a savage and primitive form of social organization. One that will end. One that must end. It is inconsistent with successful human life. Life based on Reason.
If you take issue with his beliefs, challenge them. Just as others have been challenging you on this thread. Your remark was offensive. Deliberately so.
I didn't mean to offend, sometimes my words are not communicated as clearly as I would hope.
I was trying to understand, why people in the U.S. view interracial relationships as social progression? If a couple from different ethnic backgrounds and religions wed, so bet it, but should this be held up as a great deed? This is odd to me and no I do not understand it.
Who is holding ANY couples marriage up as a great deed?
A marriage is a marriage. Period. Some single race marriages are good, some are bad. Some inter race marriages are good some are bad.
The point is we allow each person to choose for themselves what is right for them. No praise, or condemnation. It just is.
I take issue with his belief in American exceptionalism. This is what many American people may believe, but not true for other cultures outside of the U.S. It is his opinion, and not a fact, but he presents his statements like they are facts. That is a sign of brainwashing.
Couldn't we just as easily dismiss your adherence to your traditions as "brainwashing?"
Not understanding why someone would post on a forum that is based in the U.S., is predominantly populated by U.S. posters and then be surprised or offended by U.S.-centric opinions particularly when the thread specifically asks for a U.S.-based perspective.
I was trying to understand, why people in the U.S. view interracial relationships as social progression? If a couple from different ethnic backgrounds and religions wed, so bet it, but should this be held up as a great deed? This is odd to me and no I do not understand it.
Interracial relationships should perhaps not be looked at in such isolation. They are part of a broad range of social behaviors in a free society that, as a whole, comprise a rational, peaceful, and successful mode of life that enables all to thrive based on their individual magnificence. That is what makes America socially progressive. And exceptional. We have evolved to a higher standard, not because we are American, but because we have embraced Reason to a greater degree than primitive societies that feature ethnocentric orientation as a tenet of social behavior.
On the contrary, from our perspective it is you who have been brainwashed by a culture and religion that demonstrably brainwashes its adherents and forces strict adherence to a particular way of life with no room for deviation.
Then WE have all been brainwashed. Because all of us live our lives according to traditions and rules and mores that have been taught us. Rose has been sharing her beliefs with us. Which is a generous and brave thing to do. And we've been sharing our beliefs with her. I think her "brainwashing" remark was in response to the "ethnic herding" comment, because while "ethnic herding" may have sociological overtones to some of us and therefor not be offensive, it can be read and interpreted differently.
Another poster commented that restricting a person to relationships within an ethnicity is a primitive behavior. I think it's important to note that primitive behaviors are simply basic human behaviors. We can and do dismiss "primitive" behavior as being inferior, but ultimately, we all engage in "primitive" behavior in various ways. We are human, and we can't escape that about ourselves. What we can do is try to understand ourselves, why we behave the way we do.
Rose's, and many societies around the world, are much more affiliative than the United States. I don't know if anyone is familiar with McClelland's motivation theory, but there have been studies to apply the motivations to nations, to the citizens in those nations, which is instructive about how public policies in those nations are developed. Every society constructs itself in a unique fashion. It constructs social safety nets to help those it determines need help. But WHO ends up needing help is also part of the social construct. And WHO provides that help is part of the social construct. In affiliative nations, the providers of that help tend to be families and family clusters. And that means the bonds between those family clusters (ie, ethnic groups) have to be very strong. The social rules of marrying within the group helps make those bonds strong. In the US, we've shifted the social safety net provider to being the government. Whether the shift is caused by, or was caused by a shift in the social attitudes towards ethnic purism is debatable, but what isn't debatable is that the two reinforce one another.
Where we are today is not where we will be 10 years from now. And that "we" is all of us. Turkish society, Australian society, American society, Tanzanian society. Culture is constantly evolving.
I do not view it as subjugation, because I don't view men as being better or worst than women. I have stated that our roles are different, but one is not better than the other. This is why I stopped typing to you. It does no good, because you do not understand how things are outside of your culture. To understand, you would have to live in my culture. My country is not oppressive.
You have stated that one of the roles of a husband is to make all the decisions in the family, and that the role of a wife is to abide by them. That you don't see this as subjugation is simply your own brainwashing. To accuse someone who sees this for what it is as being brainwashed kind of proves the point.
You're right, I have never lived in your culture (for which I am infinitely grateful). But here in America, we do not relegate women to roles of submission to their menfolk. You keep saying you don't understand American culture, so I have simplified it for you on this topic, at least. By all means, go marry within your culture and be obedient to your husband. As an American woman, I wish you the best of luck with that.
Ahh. So you do get to make important family decisions.
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