U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 72,180,786 times
Reputation: 27563

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Bailouts were loans.
And 5 years later..many still not repaid.

We borrow money to loan out that is not repaid.
Yet the USG is on the hook to borrow even more to pay the interest on money we borrowed so we could loan out that has not been repaid.

Yeah..we'll just keep upping the debt ceiling so we can go on living this charade.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,423 posts, read 33,733,601 times
Reputation: 15106
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
When it comes to manual labor I think he speaks the truth.

Americans have this idea that they shouldn't get their hands dirty anymore.
Yet so many persist in whining that illegals are taking their jobs.
Makes no sense.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,423 posts, read 33,733,601 times
Reputation: 15106
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
And 5 years later..many still not repaid.
87% of TARP has been repaid.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:16 PM
 
160 posts, read 109,129 times
Reputation: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Bailouts were loans.

Ok, and so what? Gov't printed that money out of air, injected into the economy. What was that if not stimulus? After all, the public has to pay interest on them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 72,180,786 times
Reputation: 27563
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
87% of TARP has been repaid.
TARP is but one of several loan programs.
TARP had strings attached regarding CEO salaries/bonuses.
There was a mad rush to borrow from other Fed loan programs to pay off TARP.

Banks Repaid Fed Bailout With Other Fed Money: Government Report
But 48 percent of the banks that have repaid the CPP used money they'd gotten from other federal programs, according to the GAO report.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,423 posts, read 33,733,601 times
Reputation: 15106
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Are you counting SS equal to TANF ?
Sure seniors are dependent on government because government took their money for 30+ years and said they would give it back to them when they retired.
Seniors are indeed amongst the 47%.

Medicare was never self sustaining and required more than a 40% annual subsidy in the form of deficit spending. This is projected to be about 50% by the end of this decade.

Medicare costs could be substantially reduced if /when Congress allows Medicare to negotiate the cost of prescription medications and medical appliances as id done elsewhere.

Thus far, Congress had been more interested in protecting Big Pharm profits than reducing government costs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:27 PM
 
160 posts, read 109,129 times
Reputation: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Seniors are indeed amongst the 47%.

Medicare was never self sustaining and required more than a 40% annual subsidy in the form of deficit spending. This is projected to be about 50% by the end of this decade.

Medicare costs could be substantially reduced if /when Congress allows Medicare to negotiate the cost of prescription medications and medical appliances as id done elsewhere.

Thus far, Congress had been more interested in protecting Big Pharm profits than reducing government costs.
Hehe, Big Lobby does not sleep.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:30 PM
 
39,080 posts, read 20,168,517 times
Reputation: 12636
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Yet so many persist in whining that illegals are taking their jobs.
Makes no sense.
Union and Democratic votes. It is funny watching these liberals out there protesting for something that will hurt them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:30 PM
 
1,378 posts, read 1,803,382 times
Reputation: 980
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucknow View Post
Things will never be good again until the realization that the old model is done like dinner and will never again be successful as it was in the past. There are a few different aspects to this and I'll just address a couple of them. First of all, the USA has more than enough resources to supply the nation with ever single thing it needs. It has a large enough work force to produce and to distribute everything a society needs to live WELL. The existing financial structure absolutely prevents this from happening. THE ELITE of the world depend on globalization to maintain their exalted positions to the detriment of all the rest of us in the developed world. They will not give up their positions easily.

Another issue that we seldom hear about is the entire structure of work, renumeration for work and the reality that more and more goods and services can be produced with an ever decreasing number of workers required to produce them. We actually discussed this reality a lot in high school back in the 60s but the entire issue seems to have vanished from the public discourse since that time. It's not a popular subject in that it involves a massive redistribution of the wealth of a society. The old model of "working for a living" in the traditional sence might just be disappearing. When all of the needs of society can be met by a small % of people working 40 hours a week, what will all of the rest of the people do in their lives. I think we already see the results of this in how many people work directly or indirectly for the government. One of the reasons the unemployment in the last recession was so much less here in Canada than in the USA was because porportionately we have a much larger % of the workforce employed by the government. That's a scary thought, is it not? So, what are we to do to maintain a healthy society with secure and happy citizens when there may not be any work in the traditional sence for them to do? It's obvious the old system is failing and most of the wealth if not all of it will end up in the hands of the top 1% while an increasing % of the former middle class will dwindle down to poverty as their traditional means of support disappear.

Now, even if the productivity and wealth of the nation was such that we could afford to pay everyone without a job just to stay at home we know very well that this would be a disaster. People need a vocation of some sort or another and really suffer if they don't have some kind of working responsibility. The private sector really has to start to think about some solutions to this state of things because the only other solution is an increasing, "socialiation" of the society. It's incumbent upon the government to see to the general welfare of the citizens and if that is not either offered or possible by the private sector then the government will act in the people's interests or the society will decend to the worst of third world conditions.
You and the OP are correct. The economy will never really return to its original state and high unemployment is going to stay the new normal for a while. Neither the left nor the right can really repair this. Getting rid of onerous regulations won't bring back jobs since operating overseas will stay cheaper than operating in the USA for quite some time due to massive differences in standard of living. Americans are going to have to take near slave wages for the outsourced jobs to return.

There also has to be a paradigm shift in the current model for any kind of change to occur. The thing is it is too politically and economically risky for anyone to undertake and unfortunately no one in the upper class want any kind of change since it may impact them negatively. There also has to be a new driver in the economy for the economy to return to its original state. Unfortunately there are no new technologies coming up in the forefront that will lead to the massive economic growth during the Industrial Revolution and the Information Revolution of the 80s-90s. I also love how the media is pushing social networking as being this new technology that will create more jobs. The thing is it hasn't really created new jobs or wealth and has more or less just shifted wealth around.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-04-2013, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Barrington
45,423 posts, read 33,733,601 times
Reputation: 15106
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
TARP is but one of several loan programs.
TARP had strings attached regarding CEO salaries/bonuses.
There was a mad rush to borrow from other Fed loan programs to pay off TARP.

Banks Repaid Fed Bailout With Other Fed Money: Government Report
But 48 percent of the banks that have repaid the CPP used money they'd gotten from other federal programs, according to the GAO report.
WSJ reporting that $2.1 Billion Small Business Loan money was used by some small banks to repay TARP.
Banks Used Small-Business Aid to Repay TARP - WSJ.com
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. | Please obey Forum Rules | Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top