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Old 06-03-2013, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
2,141 posts, read 2,570,825 times
Reputation: 3182

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Quote:
Originally Posted by findly185 View Post
He works even more hours than she does. When he was/is home he was/is the one who did all of the house and car maintenance. He was also the one who did the primary care for us as children. Since my mother was never home when we got home from school.
I don't think this is an example of what people are talking about. Both of your parents worked hard in and out of the home. They may have not done the exact same jobs but your father wasn't sitting around when he was home.

 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:21 AM
 
12,196 posts, read 9,895,006 times
Reputation: 15843
Quote:
Originally Posted by findly185 View Post
I never mentioned anything about inequality here.

I stated my mother worked 70 hour weeks and made 150k but she was not a feminist and still believed in somewhat normal gender roles. I said it can be both ways.

Inequity is what is being discussed to which you are continually replying.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
21,942 posts, read 21,743,439 times
Reputation: 21501
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
Fair enough, the question is why this should be thrown upon the man's shoulders to remedy.

Feminists want to say the solution is that men should do more housework. Maybe the solution is to do less housework, and to have fewer babies.



Well, one reason would be because she made a vow to do so.



Neither is a guy who plays video games all day. It's all about realistic expectations.

The operative cliche here is: If you want to do something right, do it yourself. If a woman wants to leave the housekeeping up to the man, she has no room to complain when it isn't up to her standards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
I don't know what you mean by "this", but I was describing misaligned expectations.
Misaligned expectations. Normally when a couple marry the expectation is to be equal partners and to help one another to build a comfortable life and perhaps strong family. This means shouldering your share of the responsibility. I dont think anyone intentionally vows to become their spouses parent.

The problem is not just do more housework to a woman's expectations. At its base the problem is the attitude that many of these men have that it is just not "their job" to do the things that need done in order to keep a home running so they do basically nothing while their wife not only contributes equally or more financially but does nearly everything else too.

Your attitude seems to be if your stressed out and worn down about the workload lower your expectations: live in filth, wear dirty clothes, eat take out, screw the kids hygiene, extra curricular activities and education.
Its the equivalent of a man working two jobs so his wife can be a SAHM but she dosent do any housework or take care of the kids.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:43 AM
 
Location: Toronto
2,161 posts, read 2,351,848 times
Reputation: 1148
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djuna View Post
Really?

I make more than my husband by a huge amount. We both wear pants, we both make major decisions, we both control the budget. Funny how that works isn't it.
I sah and we're the same. We're partners.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Toronto
2,161 posts, read 2,351,848 times
Reputation: 1148
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
Wait, if a woman agreed to take on the role of a grown man's mother, wouldn't that make her stupid?

And wouldn't that make her kind of sadistic, for first agreeing to that, and then later rationalizing her way out by humiliating and emasculating him?



We don't know that.
Hence I said that no woman agrees to that.

When I hear he helped "babysit" (no father babysits, it's called parenting) while she made dinner and that was the extent of his housework, yeah, children's aid would come knocking if she limited herself to the amount of work the guy did.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Toronto
2,161 posts, read 2,351,848 times
Reputation: 1148
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Why does he deserve that any more than the woman does for choosing him?
For being douche bag. Seriously? I've seen a couple of miserable marriages that ended in divorce this way and heard variations of this story too many times from women online I've met through an online group. I cannot understand what these guys thought marriage was going to be? Obviously, these women had poor radars. But the misery these guys cause to their wives and being such crappy fathers. These men get kudo's for being present fathers but they're not fathering anyone. They shouldn't get any brownie points for this crap. In some ways it's worse than walking out on the woman because people assume that she's getting help.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
21,942 posts, read 21,743,439 times
Reputation: 21501
Quote:
Originally Posted by findly185 View Post
Letsjust say I look at it this way...
Quote:
Originally Posted by findly185 View Post

While mymother was not the breadwinner, she worked 70 hr weeks and made/makes over 150ka year. She still believes it is her job as a wife/mother/women to clean thehouse, do the laundry, make dinner etc. She also helps care for my father'selderly father who lives with my parents. She thinks it is her responsibilityto make sure he is well cared for. All while working 6 12hr night shifts aweek.

I wouldn'tconsider her a feminist by any means.


I guess it depends on your definition of a feminist. Some people equate the word with a few extreme types that tend to have a chip on their shoulder. I consider anyone who believes and participates in equal opportunities and rights for women a feminist. I consider myself a feminist. I have always worked, been self-sufficient and strong willed, even when I was married but I also kept the house and cooked and love caring for my kids.


 
Old 06-03-2013, 11:02 AM
 
12,196 posts, read 9,895,006 times
Reputation: 15843
Quote:
Originally Posted by monemi View Post
For being douche bag. Seriously? I've seen a couple of miserable marriages that ended in divorce this way and heard variations of this story too many times from women online I've met through an online group.
Yah. You hear it from men too. She is such a nag etc.

Quote:
I cannot understand what these guys thought marriage was going to be?
About love. And fun like once upon a time they had shared together before she became a harpie shrew. The flips side is equally valid. He thought marriage was going to be very similar to what they had previously experienced. Why would they expect anything else? SHE was the one who changed the rules mid stream.

Truth is, men are super easy to train.
 
Old 06-03-2013, 11:09 AM
 
9,412 posts, read 11,738,368 times
Reputation: 20226
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post

I guess it depends on your definition of a feminist. Some people equate the word with a few extreme types that tend to have a chip on their shoulder. I consider anyone who believes and participates in equal opportunities and rights for women a feminist. I consider myself a feminist. I have always worked, been self-sufficient and strong willed, even when I was married but I also kept the house and cooked and love caring for my kids.


I agree with you because this reflects my feminist philosophy as well. I have never been a radical, my men are always treated well and I am a ardent believer in equality for all.

Last edited by Djuna; 06-03-2013 at 11:20 AM..
 
Old 06-03-2013, 11:13 AM
 
5,663 posts, read 4,376,587 times
Reputation: 5614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djuna View Post
I make more than my husband by a huge amount. We both wear pants, we both make major decisions, we both control the budget. Funny how that works isn't it.
It's exactly the same here, my wife earns coooooooonsiderably more than I do, has done for about 15yrs and it bothers me not one jot. She can spend what she wants as do I, every bill gets paid by us, it's our money. We're a partnership.
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