Military plans would put women in most combat jobs (politician, carry, election)
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Ive just taken a couple rounds in the shoulder and torso and my arms been blown half off. I am praying to freakin God the corpsman in my unit is Wayne Caron and not Karen Wayne
USS Caron DD 970
While on a sweep through an open rice field HC3c. Caron's unit started receiving enemy small arms fire. Upon seeing two Marine casualties fall, he immediately ran forward to render first aid, but found that they were dead. At this time, the platoon was taken under intense small-arms and automatic weapons fire, sustaining additional casualties. As he moved to the aid of his wounded comrades, HC3c. Caron was hit in the arm by enemy fire. Although knocked to the ground, he regained his feet and continued to the injured Marines. He rendered medical assistance to the first Marine he reached, who was grievously wounded, and undoubtedly was instrumental in saving the man's life. HC3c. Caron then ran toward the second wounded Marine, but was again hit by enemy fire, this time in the leg. Nonetheless, he crawled the remaining distance and provided medical aid for this severely wounded man. HC3c. Caron started to make his way to yet another injured comrade, when he was again struck by enemy small-arms fire. Courageously and with unbelievable determination, HC3c. Caron continued his attempt to reach the third Marine until he was killed by an enemy rocket round.
Ive just taken a couple rounds in the shoulder and torso and my arms been blown half off. I am praying to freakin God the corpsman in my unit is Wayne Caron and not Karen Wayne
Wayne Caron displayed notable bravery and dedication on the battlefield under enemy fire, and was deserving of his CMoH.
But he wasn't brave because he had a penis. Countless women throughout history have displayed similar bravery on the battlefield, just as countless men throughout history have messed their pants at the first sign of the enemy.
We could start by making the PT tests similar than! If they are in fact equal! And for the record, I say let em try to be a Seal. I doubt any will pass without lowering the standards!
The nature of modern warfare is changing with robotic and computers and other hardware. The warfighter is increasingly insulated by a formidable shield of technology and with what we have in our R&D centers wars will be short and American military personnel may be hundreds if not thousands of miles safely seated in command and control stations. They will be in combat since the weapons they control are engaing the foe and they are as aware of the battle field situation as if they were actually standind there pulling the trigger. The only difference is they will shed no blood but the enemy will. The sex of the warfighter in such operations is not relevant. There may be a few military jobs where it is still brute force hand to hand combat of the type familiar to our ancestors thousands of years ago but for every member of special forces there will be at least 10 or 100 service members whose posting will be a computer work station a a maintenance shop or or a supply warehouse. Combat experience is a necesscity for high command (since a service chief) must know what itis like to to be under fire and to deal with the confusing disorder of a battlefield. The military will not achieve true gender equality until at least one of the Service Chiefs (The 4 star ranks) , the Chaiman of Joint Chiefs and key posts like the Chief of Naval Operations, Marine Comandant, Army Chief of Staff or the CincPac or CincAtlant is a women.
I was in the U.S. Marine Corps from '89 to '93. I went in open contract and got 0311 (basic rifleman) as my MOS. While in SOI (School of Infantry) I volunteered for Security Forces and got in. So, I had a second MOS (I also skated and did all my time in Security Forces).
I can see you never went through SOI or did infantry training? You're conception of infantry life is way off.
I don't really care about women getting into the infantry or special ops--except for the fact I object to extending deaths/injuries etc. increasingly to women now--because very, very, few of them will qualify. I say that because WM's seemed to have trouble humping the loads male Marines did at the pace male Marines marched. Plus, there are just other rigorous aspects of infantry life. It's like laying 16' block as a mason in construction, or being a laborer for masons with all the shovel, tendering their "mud," and moving heavy wheelbarrows over bumpy ground in 90 degree weather and 30 degree weather. Very few women apply for those jobs and do those jobs even though they're free to do them. The work is back breaking. And the cold especially can get to you mentally.
Some women will make it but very few. Most won't want to be in infantry anyways.
I was a very small Marine in body weight and height. Ectomorph to boot. And I'm not sure their existed a woman in the Marine Corps that could out hump me then. Well... maybe there was. I just didn't meet her or see her. I was not star at humping either. I humped the weight given me (thank God I did not hump the SAW or M60) like other Marines. And the tall Marines were often up front leading the pace of the march.
For me It has to do with the male being naturally bigger and stronger. Theres also hundreds of thousands of years of natural selection and adaption of the species gender that make men able to react better in the violent environment of battle. Ill pray for my corpsman you pray for yours
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwkilgore
Wayne Caron displayed notable bravery and dedication on the battlefield under enemy fire, and was deserving of his CMoH.
But he wasn't brave because he had a penis. Countless women throughout history have displayed similar bravery on the battlefield, just as countless men throughout history have messed their pants at the first sign of the enemy.
We could start by making the PT tests similar than! If they are in fact equal! And for the record, I say let em try to be a Seal. I doubt any will pass without lowering the standards!
Very few will get through Marine SOI let alone SEAL training. What is it called, "BUDS"?
Even if 20 women passed through and graduated SOI probably only 1 or 3 of them would want to remain in the infantry. Fire team rushes up some hill? With a gas mask on? Naw, I doubt they'll want stick with that too much.
Women can be construction workers in the U.S. but you don't see many feminist going into those trades do you? No. And I don't blame them. You can remain feminist and have a much more sedentary life in a corporate office, as a police officer driving in a squad car, or as an MP in the military, or doing security in Security Forces (save FAST Company or the times those in basic security in the battalion train in the field).
I've seen some tall, huge (super sexy too) Brazilian women humping packs up and down snowy mountains in some tea, Eco-Challenge. Those women were beast! Now, they'd more than likely get through SOI. The only man on their team was actually the one that kept complaining, falling behind, and malingering. All the Brazilian women were tall Amazonian a___ kickers. Thighs as big as mountains. And all of them fine too. I think all those chick were well over 6 feet tall. None were skinny either like I said.
And if you believe this, I have some beach front property in Kansas to sell you. Oh yes, the check is in the mail. Mind you, I am not totally against women in combat. IF they can pass the proper testing, without it being "fudged" and distorted, fine. More power to them.
However, its not THEM I am worried about. The general public is already conditioned to have men coming home from wars blown to hell, killed, missing limbs, etc. How is the general public going to feel when its a bucket full of women now? Now, I realize what some will say: But Phil, it has already occurred. Yes, it has. However, no where NEAR the scale of men. People better get used to the fact women in combat are going to get killed, maimed, raped, sodomized, et al. The addage: "Be careful what you wish for comes" into play here.
Think about the D-Day Landings. What IF there 3 thousand women killed there that day. Are people going to be content with that? No one is content with males being killed. However, alot of us were brought up to hold women out on a platform. Women are women and as such, they get special treatment. You hold the door open for them, you do these sorts of things. Now they are coming home, in large numbers, missing their legs.
I can see a large portion of the population complaining.
I don't know .... we recently saw 6 women gunned down in the space of around 5 minutes.
I live about a 20 minute drive from Sandy Hook Elementary.
For me It has to do with the male being naturally bigger and stronger. Theres also hundreds of thousands of years of natural selection and adaption of the species gender that make men able to react better in the violent environment of battle. Ill pray for my corpsman you pray for yours
I assure you I have no penis envy, but if imagining me that way is how you cope when someone threatens your masculinity then go for it; doesn't affect my feelings at all.
I agree that male humans are naturally bigger and stronger. Take 100 random males and 100 random females and, almost without exception, the biggest males will be bigger and stronger than the biggest females, plus the average male will be bigger and stronger than the average female. Because "the male" is naturally bigger and stronger, "the male" will always dominate the world's military units. Anyone with any knowledge of humans should agree with this. But what you are neglecting is the fact that there is a massive variation in size and strength within the genders, and the biggest females will be far bigger and stronger than the average males.
I'm currently a middle-age male far from in the best shape, but even in my football-playing weight-lifting prime I had no delusions about my ability to pass the Navy Seal physical fitness tests (no chance whatsoever). I also had no delusions that the biggest and strongest female athletes could kick my butt even then.
If a female thinks she can pass the physical and mental tests required to join ANY military unit (unaltered from the same tests that males must pass), she should be allowed to try. If she passes, she's tough enough and she's in.
If you think all women will crack under battle pressure, I urge to you to go to the delivery ward of a hospital and say that to women in labor. If you try, I guarantee that before you leave YOU'LL be the one with penis envy because you'll no longer have one.
I think this has more to do with earning the Combat Infantry Badge that is almost mandatory for promotion to higher levels in the officer corps than anything else.
The fuss about physical strength is just that - a fuss. So long as a woman can carry a gun and enough ammo for the job let her do it if she wants. Besides a firefight in a broom closet or an abandoned building is more about cunning and ferocity than being able to carry a hundred pounds of stuff.
Move light, move fast and aim every shot even if you have a 12 gauge scattergun. Don’t stop until all the enemy are dead.
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