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Old 06-26-2013, 07:42 AM
 
14,292 posts, read 9,677,147 times
Reputation: 4254

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHurricaneKid View Post
The government is only as good as the loyalty of those within it. The only way we can get abused by the monitoring system is if abusive people take control of the monitoring system. Same thing applies to the police and military.

Either way, both the government, the police, and the espionage departments have grown more powerful since the writing of the constitution. For how much longer can we expect the system to stay honest and not corrupted?
We have already crossed that line.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:46 AM
 
Location: South Portland, ME
893 posts, read 1,207,273 times
Reputation: 902
The problem is that when it comes to government agencies, you ONLY get the abusive power hungry people because that's the kind of work it is. When you get an actual normal person who has a "moral compass" and doesn't believe in abusing power, then you end up with that person fleeing to China or Russia because they couldn't accept being part of that any longer.

So basically, the only solution is to shut them all down - we don't need (or want) people doing that kind of work anyways.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,747,599 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoulesMSU View Post
The problem is that when it comes to government agencies, you ONLY get the abusive power hungry people because that's the kind of work it is. When you get an actual normal person who has a "moral compass" and doesn't believe in abusing power, then you end up with that person fleeing to China or Russia because they couldn't accept being part of that any longer.

So basically, the only solution is to shut them all down - we don't need (or want) people doing that kind of work anyways.
What a crock of compost!

I have a good friend who worked for the NSA. He is an "actual normal person". Snowden, OTOH. . . .
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:49 AM
 
6,137 posts, read 4,860,984 times
Reputation: 1517
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
I trust them as much as I trust any other American.
If you're smart, that means not at all.
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:50 AM
 
Location: South Portland, ME
893 posts, read 1,207,273 times
Reputation: 902
Quote:
The OP's assumption that anyone who works for government is knowingly and willingly complicit in its actions is way too simple.
They are complicit though. Sure, you can claim that the guards outside the gates of Auschwitz were just "doing their job" and didn't necessarily agree with what was going on behind them, but they didn't do anything to stop it, so they were complicit.

It's the same with anyone else who works for NSA, CIA, even TSA - if you know it's going on, you are complicit in it, unless you try to do something to stop it, like Snowden.

Quote:
I have a good friend who worked for the NSA. He is an "actual normal person". Snowden, OTOH. . . .
No, your "good friend" is most likely a sociopath who enjoys spying on people and doing nefarious things. Otherwise, why haven't they also tried to do something to stop it?

FYI: A sociopath "is a mental health condition in which a person has a long-term pattern of manipulating, exploiting, or violating the rights of others. This behavior is often criminal."

AKA, it's the only kind of person who could work for NSA and not be bothered by it...
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Old 06-26-2013, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Missouri
4,272 posts, read 3,787,515 times
Reputation: 1937
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoulesMSU View Post
They are complicit though. Sure, you can claim that the guards outside the gates of Auschwitz were just "doing their job" and didn't necessarily agree with what was going on behind them, but they didn't do anything to stop it, so they were complicit.

It's the same with anyone else who works for NSA, CIA, even TSA - if you know it's going on, you are complicit in it, unless you try to do something to stop it, like Snowden.


What is IT that they are complicit in? Certainly not the mass execution of Jews.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,281,090 times
Reputation: 3826
Quote:
Originally Posted by geofra View Post
Public employees work for their employer just like everyone else. Paycheck, perks, or benefits. Maybe it is that simple.



To get the bad guy?? Not even close.
Promotions, etc are gauged by "getting the bad guy" many times over.

Creates a nice incentive to promote corruption. Just ask any former Stasi HQ investigator.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:20 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,281,090 times
Reputation: 3826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
What a crock of compost!

I have a good friend who worked for the NSA. He is an "actual normal person". Snowden, OTOH. . . .
Was it the six figure job, hot girlfriend, military past, or his tech background that made you think he wasn't normal?
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,747,599 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by summers73 View Post
Was it the six figure job, hot girlfriend, military past, or his tech background that made you think he wasn't normal?
My friend has all the above. (I always thought he made plenty of money; he is married to my BFF from high school; is ex-Air Force and has an engineering degree.)

It's Snowden's reality orientation, or rather the lack thereof that show's he's not normal. He thinks he's a hero. May he enjoy life in Russia.
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,054 posts, read 18,281,090 times
Reputation: 3826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
His reality orientation, or rather the lack thereof. He thinks he's a hero. May he enjoy life in Russia.
When did Snowden say he thought he was a hero? He seemed quite rational in his interview. Probably more rational than your "friend" on a good day.

What country would you have fled to? Lemme guess: Canada? The UK? LOL
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