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Old 08-19-2013, 11:19 PM
 
29,409 posts, read 21,969,904 times
Reputation: 5455

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What will of the people? 32 times since '98 gay marriage has been voted down at the ballot box.

 
Old 08-19-2013, 11:28 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,627 posts, read 26,311,930 times
Reputation: 12635
Quote:
Originally Posted by adiosToreador View Post
Pretty sure the expressed will of the people were to get homosexuals the right to marry and equal rights in this country.

Stop crying just because we don't live in the 1950s anymore.

Homosexuals already have equal rights.

What you are trying to do is provide special rights to homosexuals.
 
Old 08-19-2013, 11:39 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,239,057 times
Reputation: 11416
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBest View Post
Your entire premise was that the military was acting to provide certain privileges to homosexuals so they can get married. According to what you say above, a homosexual should be fully aware that they are giving up freedoms and liberties when they join the military. In accordance, the military shall continue to provide to exception based on lifestyle.

I never said anyone would abuse it. It's just stupid to provide homosexuals extra leave because they follow a certain lifestyle while not giving heterosexuals the same leave. Your premise is that it's because all states don't allow gay marriage. But you have no interest in fixing that problem. You'd rather the military implement some band-aid solution.


You're the one who wants to keep the benefits unequal. That though-process a disgrace to this nation. Give everyone, gay or straight the same benefits. Federal and state benefits should apply to all. Stop treating them like they are different animals with different rights. You make me sick.
The benefits are currently not equal.
By your logic, single members should receive the same BAQ, etc. as married ones.
Or, married service members should receive not one dime more than single - no extra space for housing, no educational benefits, etc. that are provided for married, not single servicemembers.
 
Old 08-19-2013, 11:44 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,239,057 times
Reputation: 11416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tymberwulf View Post
I personally don't care one way or the other about the gay marriage issue (my philosophy is that right or wrong I'm not the one assigned to judge) but this new rule is a load of horse manure! Granting free leave to one small part of the armed forces while denying it to another is only going to create more tension between those two groups in the military.

The armed forces works on teamwork and knowing the same rules applies to everyone who wears the uniform, now the DoD has decided that certain members should be held about others, and this just won't sit well with some folks.
Good, then force all states to recognize gay marriage and the problem is over.
The same rules do not apply. Hets can get married, gays cannot.
Where is the demand for equality in granting all citizens the right to marry?
 
Old 08-19-2013, 11:50 PM
 
29,409 posts, read 21,969,904 times
Reputation: 5455
Force? I guess you haven't heard of the Constitution. Not a shock.
 
Old 08-20-2013, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles, California
4,373 posts, read 3,223,282 times
Reputation: 1041
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Homosexuals already have equal rights.
NOW they do after years of inequality, sure. They can serve openly in the military now have up to 20 states where they can get married. It's a start.

Quote:
What you are trying to do is provide special rights to homosexuals.
No, *I* am NOT trying to do anything. You need to take YOUR gripe with the institution that's allowing this and put this regulation in place - the United States Military.
 
Old 08-20-2013, 12:23 PM
 
10,092 posts, read 8,190,445 times
Reputation: 3411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
I want equality to mean just that. If they had come out and said "Service members who wish to enter into what is a legal marriage in an American state, but that is not legal at their current duty station, are authorized to take up to 10 day uncharged leave to travel to a state that permits that marriage," - which would have accomplished their goal without granting special privileges - I would have no comment about this, and indeed can see its merit. You just don't get it. Any time you give rights, privileges and/or benefits based on group membership, that is denied/not offered to other groups, it is wrong. Either you believe in equality or you don't. I do - for ALL groups. You are only interested in what benefits your chosen group.
You're confusing me, because according to the article you linked to, that's basically what they did. If you are stationed more than 100 miles from a state that has legalized gay marriage, you can take up to 10 days of leave to go get married. It doesn't say you'll get the whole 10 days. It's significant that a big chunk of bases are in the south where it could easily be a three day drive to get to a state that could marry them. I don't see how gay people are getting any special rights through this, or how any are being taken away from straight people. If you want EQUALITY, then you'd have legalized gay marriage in all 50 states, and this discussion would be a non issue. Since things ARE NOT EQUAL for gay people, this is a way to address the inequality fairly so they can make sure they can offer their spouses all the legal protections and benefits that straight couples currently gain through marriage.
 
Old 08-20-2013, 12:30 PM
 
10,092 posts, read 8,190,445 times
Reputation: 3411
Quote:
Originally Posted by elan View Post
So, they are traveling by stagecoach, how quaint.
Where do you live? It takes an entire day to drive across my state alone--Nebraska. With the exception of Iowa and California, all of the gay marriage states are in the northeast. In case you haven't noticed, we don't exactly pay our low ranked military personnel all that much, so there's a pretty good chance they're going to have to drive vs fly. Airfare has gone through the roof, and I find it pretty unlikely that you'd find a cross country fare for much less than $8-900/dollars per person round trip, and those are discounted rates. If you're on a tight budget, that's pretty pricey for two people.
 
Old 08-20-2013, 12:36 PM
 
10,092 posts, read 8,190,445 times
Reputation: 3411
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Homosexuals already have equal rights.

What you are trying to do is provide special rights to homosexuals.
Sorry, but that's really dumb.

Nobody is giving special rights to gay people--the military is trying to address a very unfair and UNEQUAL situation that gays face who are stationed on bases in all but 13 states of the US--they can't get married locally. Because of that INEQUALITY in the system, the military put in place a policy that addresses the problem to make it a little more fair. Straight people can leave the base, go to a courthouse, and get married immediately. Gay people have to drive half way across the country. Giving them the time off to do that so they can protect their family with all of the current legal protections and benefits offered through marriage in this country is the FAIR thing to do.
 
Old 08-20-2013, 12:40 PM
 
10,092 posts, read 8,190,445 times
Reputation: 3411
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
When they can't get married in every state, I will agree.
As it stands, that is not the case.
Give gays marriage rights in all states and, voila, the perceived problem goes away.
That's exactly it. Once gay marriage is available in every state, then there is no more problem, and no reason for gay couples to get extra leave to travel to be married. It's a simple solution.
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