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Indeed he was. Wolf had Newt on Sit Room to advise Boehner how to deal with the shutdown .. I think I heard him suggest that John relocate his tanning booth to the Lunar Sea of Tranquility.
Status:
"Smartened up and walked away!"
(set 26 days ago)
11,780 posts, read 5,792,331 times
Reputation: 14201
Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude
This is a done deal. There will be a shutdown. The American people will blame the Republican House. The American people understand the difference between a Continuing Resolution and hostage taking.
The tone deafness of the Tea Party is breathtaking.
You think that the rest of Americans think like you. A lot of Americans, like myself, see that the Democratic party are the ones unable to negotiate. As a Democrat - I'm appalled that they are as unyielding as the President and don't do what the majority of Americans that elected them want. The party is losing it's base in droves to third parties and yet still feel they are doing nothing wrong.
The only hostage taking is voting through a bill when they had a super majority for three months as they knew it wouldn't pass otherwise. They are holding the working Americans hostage with a program that has no funding as they have eliminated themselves and 80% of the payees for the funding through Obama's exemptions.
The party is losing it's base in droves to third parties and yet still feel they are doing nothing wrong.
No, not really, the only reason we democrats are mad about Obama is that he's too wishy washy, he lacks spine in standing up to the cons, that's his major fault, but to claim democrat voters are jumping ship? that's a stretch of imagination.
Well, 400,000 defense workers, to begin with, will be furloughed without pay. (Note: It won't affect contractors, who have appropriated funding from before the shutdown took place. They will keep working and getting paid.) The ones who will be furloughed are part of the civilian workforce who act as support staff to the military. You know, just average Americans working for a living.
All told, 800,000 to 900,000 American workers will be sent home with no pay until this is resolved. But what are the lives of nearly a million Americans, so long as it doesn't directly affect you, right?
Only the employees deemed "non-essential" will be furloughed. I imagine it's a shock to a lot of people that nearly 1,000,000 Federal employees are deemed to be "non essential. Obama referred several times in his latest "statement" (no questions allowed of course) that their pay would be "delayed". Those employees deemed "non-essential" know fully well that they will only receive that pay for the days they never worked IF the Congress passes a bill to give them the back pay for work they never did.
17 Government "shut-downs" since the 1970's and in each and every one of them --
1. The stock market did not fall
2. The Congress passed legislation to restore the pay they never worked for.
3. The vast majority of the American public never noticed the "shut-down.
On the other hand ..... they may be putting the cart before the horse. IF the Democrat and Republicans are as divided as they are (the most divided in modern history) - there is every possibility that the Congress will NEVER be able to agree to restore this pay that these "non-essential" employees never worked for. According to Law - these employees are not allowed to go into work at all, there are also a lot of limitations on what they can do with their furlough time.
It's the pits for all of them, just as it is for every Company in American that has a "shut down" due to a Union Strike. Been there, done that .... the last time was in 2009 and the strike lasted for 6 weeks. Not a single soul got 'back pay' for time they did not work. Maybe these employees are Obama followers and cheer his move, maybe they are not and are unhappy with the situation ..... thing is that this has become a way of life now. We lurch from one Crisis to another all the time. Everyone needs to plan from the policy of Crisis du Jour and Never let a Crisis go to Waste.
It's the American "New Normal" - our Transformed America.
No, not really, the only reason we democrats are mad about Obama is that he's too wishy washy, he lacks spine in standing up to the cons, that's his major fault, but to claim democrat voters are jumping ship? that's a stretch of imagination.
Both sides will always maintain their hardliners. Some are very comfortable allowing others to think for them.
Status:
"Smartened up and walked away!"
(set 26 days ago)
11,780 posts, read 5,792,331 times
Reputation: 14201
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan
No, not really, the only reason we democrats are mad about Obama is that he's too wishy washy, he lacks spine in standing up to the cons, that's his major fault, but to claim democrat voters are jumping ship? that's a stretch of imagination.
Sorry but it's been well reported that Democrats are jumping ship and going to third parties and those that have stayed aren't happy with their representation.
There was a time when the Democratic party was composed of primarily middle class working Americans. But through the years they have become disillusioned with rising taxes and having to take on the bulk of the social programs for those less fortunate. Unfortunately, that middle class is shrinking and it's now called survival. Alternative parties at least give them hope that things can change.
You think that the rest of Americans think like you. A lot of Americans, like myself, see that the Democratic party are the ones unable to negotiate. As a Democrat - I'm appalled that they are as unyielding as the President and don't do what the majority of Americans that elected them want. The party is losing it's base in droves to third parties and yet still feel they are doing nothing wrong.
The only hostage taking is voting through a bill when they had a super majority for three months as they knew it wouldn't pass otherwise. They are holding the working Americans hostage with a program that has no funding as they have eliminated themselves and 80% of the payees for the funding through Obama's exemptions.
Yes.
A Democratic President was easily re-elected less than 11 months ago.
In the Senate, where the field looked prime for Republican pickups, the Democrats actually added two seats.
In the House, the Democratic candidates got 1.7 million more votes than Republican candidates, losing only because of district gerrymandering.
"[L]osing it's base in droves", indeed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xray731
Sorry but it's been well reported that Democrats are jumping ship and going to third parties and those that have stayed aren't happy with their representation.
Yes, you're reporting it. It's just not happening when Democrats, you know, vote.
And some people think what actually happens is more representative of reality than what you claim is happening. Just so you know.
Status:
"Smartened up and walked away!"
(set 26 days ago)
11,780 posts, read 5,792,331 times
Reputation: 14201
Of course when you actively go into poorer areas and bus people to the polls - you're going to get more voters. When you go and actively sign up people for your free phones - you'll get more voters. The democrats are no longer a party to be proud of. You had a president who didn't know what the meaning of sex was - once he decided to admit to his White House party for two and now we have a president who's wishy washy - finds out about everything when the American people do and has no idea what his appointees are up to.
Sorry but I'm a Democrat but disgusted with the party and those that can't think for themselves but continue to make excuses or deny the problems of the current administration. To think that Gary Hart pulled out of the race because he was caught in a boat with a woman who was not his wife but it's OK for someone to give head to the POTUS in the White House. The morals and ethics of the Democrats has sunk to a new low.
Troll territory because I asked what was on the table for the GOP? We know what they are demanding of the Democrats, but we have not seen what they would be willing to give up to get what they want. That's how negotiations work, you know. So if the other side isn't willing to give anything up to get what they want, then Reid and Obama are right, why should they "negotiate" when it's really just one side making demands?
And you still haven't answered that question. What's in it for the Democrats?
No problem - I've gotten the message that "troll territory" is OK for some posters, so carry on. It's perfectly OK for the Democrats to claim "I will not negotiate and I will not even speak to Republicans".
This perspective is insanity. Can conservatives think rationally?
This the objective reality of the situation, the conservatives and Democrats in the Congress as well as the President all agree the government has to be funded. There is no disagreement.
Now the Democratic party which controls 2/3rds of the government is not asking the conservatives for a single concession to vote to fund the government.
conservatives who control 1/3rd of the government are asking for a huge concession without offering anything in return.
Why should the Democrats in Congress agree to destroy their bill and get nothing?
I have asked this question repeatedly and not one conservative has even attempted to answer it.
The larger point is that this situation is not a compromise. It is not a negotiation. The Democrats negotiate away their bill and get nothing.
While the conservatives who agree the government has to be funded gets to destroy the health care bill and give up nothing.
In what world does that makes sense to sane people?
Well gee when the GOP won control of the Wisconsin state legislature and were in the process of passing a bill that the Dems did not like the Dem Senators ran away and hid out in neighboring Illinois to prevent the bill from being voted on. Is that what you call sane?
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