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Old 10-02-2013, 09:03 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDusr View Post
Not just regs. Remember the govt is controlling shareholder of those publicly traded corps. Not to mention Hospital and Health care districts. Health care industry is big profits for govt.
Really?

How so?
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:10 PM
 
2,672 posts, read 2,718,069 times
Reputation: 1041
Quote:
Originally Posted by tickyul View Post
I think a SERIOUS, non-partisan look at what levels of end-of-life/life-sustaining care is appropriate, beneficial and fiscally responsible.

A much better attitude toward the dying process, palliative care and death are in order. Many times people with no chance of meaningful recovery...are kept alive due to the wishes of family members of corrupt doctors and hospitals.

Sustaining the near dead is a huge cost to the healthcare system.
This is one of the best posts I have seen on health care. My Dad went into the hospital and they kept him alive until the very day until Medicare ran out. They tried to bill for about $300,000 for one month but settled on $40,000. My dad didn't have a plan and requested to be kept alive when he went in. After a few days he really couldn't change his mind. This goes on all the time. The Republican answer is Sarah Palin and Death Panels. A lot of people cant accept the fact that they are going to die.
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Chicago
3,391 posts, read 4,481,819 times
Reputation: 7857
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseygal4u View Post
So,I see lots of people are against ACA.

Yet,not one person,heck not even congressman,has offered an alternative.
I haven't read Ted Cruz plan yet.
Does he even have a plan?

I'm not sure I can think of any other way.
The current system cannot stand,however. It was broke.
As an Rn,I see the failures of the current system all the time.
As a 24 year old,there was no way in He** I could afford a $425 private plan?
No way,no how.
The best option would have been a Canadian-style single-payer system. If doctors, hospitals and drug companies had to negotiate with just one entity in order to get paid, they would have no choice but to negotiate reasonable rates. That would have given the insured a huge amount of leverage. But that was never on the table...
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:26 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltschmerz View Post
Again, do you have anything to back that up? You can say "Here is what I will provide", but you didn't answer the question at all. You seem to have pulled those stats out of your nether regions.
Show me anything suggesting that patients with Stage 3/4 cancer do better in the US than patients with Stage 2 cancers in other industrialized countries.
Table 5 compares and contrasts Cancer survival rates by nation. In most cases, the U.S. is #1.

http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/con...spc-027766.pdf

What these broad numbers do not show is detection and survival by age. And that's where there's a difference. Cancers in those under 65 tens to be diagnosed earlier in some nations than the U.S., presumably because people in countries with universal healthcare are more likely to have routine screenings than people who have no insurance.

Cancer is more likely to inflict people over 65. At this point, Medicare kicks in and enables people to get screened and detected sooner which means their chance of survival is greater.
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by tickyul View Post
I think a SERIOUS, non-partisan look at what levels of end-of-life/life-sustaining care is appropriate, beneficial and fiscally responsible.

A much better attitude toward the dying process, palliative care and death are in order. Many times people with no chance of meaningful recovery...are kept alive due to the wishes of family members or corrupt doctors and hospitals.

Sustaining the near dead is a huge cost to the healthcare system.


I would also add assisted suicide for those with late stage terminal situations that choose death with dignity.
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:32 PM
 
3,009 posts, read 3,642,528 times
Reputation: 2376
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
The best option would have been a Canadian-style single-payer system. If doctors, hospitals and drug companies had to negotiate with just one entity in order to get paid, they would have no choice but to negotiate reasonable rates. That would have given the insured a huge amount of leverage. But that was never on the table...

On top of that America would have to fix a lot of things.
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:41 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Thanks for the "CD Joke of the Day" (in bold)! Just WHO do you think is running hospitals now? Here is the bio for the new administrator of my local hospital:

Dennis received his Bachelor of Science degree in Physical Education from Andrews University in Berrien Springs, Mich.; his Master in Exercise Physiology degree from Iowa State University and his Master of Business Administration degree from Bowling Green State University in Ohio. - See more at: Dennis Barts | Avista Adventist Hospital | Louisville

Now this, mind you is a small, non-profit, church-related (Seventh Day Adventist) hospital. I'd say it's even more "businesslike" at the larger hospitals, especially the for-profits.
The non MD CEO at my local hospital has a base annual compensation of $4 million.

Hospital boards pay consulting firms to determine the market value of senior administrators . They tend to error on the high side to allow the board to feel comfortable competing for an administrator.The hospital board also pays a substantial percentage of the negotiated compensation package to the same firm to conduct the search and make the best match.

Those administrators who have demonstrated the ability to reduce operating costs and increase profits to expand the brand and wipe out the competition are in high demand.
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Old 10-02-2013, 09:52 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
People keep talking about how medicare and medicaid are large entities and can get better prices.

Well, that is true to an extent. But if you really think about it, it doesn't really make that much sense. When has it ever been true that the government can produce something, or get something, at a lower price than a free market?

Medicare pays the lowest price, cost plus overhead. Then come those insurers with PPO arrangements.

The reality of the healthcare industry, and why its prices are so jacked up. Is that the healthcare industry simply is not a free market. If healthcare was a free market, there is no way healthcare could be provided more cheaply, or at a higher quality, by a government takeover.

The reason why the healthcare system is not a free market. Is because the government regulates the healthcare industry more than any other industry in this country. Thus I must repeat my previous point. If the government completely got out of healthcare. The price of healthcare would drop like a rock.

The healthcare industry has been and continues to contract. It's moving from a free market to a monopoly.

Healthcare is substantially more regulated in some nations and the cost of healthcare is substantially less. How is this possible?

When we talk about the cost of healthcare, we have to understand the whole system is designed to the take the costs of some, and transfer it to others. Rather than make people actually pay for their own costs.

For instance, my friend, who has no insurance, ran up a $1,500 emergency room bill. He never paid that bill, and recently he got a settlement offer from the hospital, for $214. How is it remotely possible that the bill costs seven times more than what they are willing to accept? What other businesses operate like that?
All businesses with unsecured consumer debt operate like this. At some point they sell their bad debt for pennies on the $ to collection agencies. These agencies then will negotiate a settlement that ensures they make a profit.
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Old 10-02-2013, 10:09 PM
 
3 posts, read 2,419 times
Reputation: 10
Exercise.
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Old 10-02-2013, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Montreal, Quebec
15,080 posts, read 14,323,230 times
Reputation: 9789
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Table 5 compares and contrasts Cancer survival rates by nation. In most cases, the U.S. is #1.

http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/con...spc-027766.pdf

What these broad numbers do not show is detection and survival by age. And that's where there's a difference. Cancers in those under 65 tens to be diagnosed earlier in some nations than the U.S., presumably because people in countries with universal healthcare are more likely to have routine screenings than people who have no insurance.

Cancer is more likely to inflict people over 65. At this point, Medicare kicks in and enables people to get screened and detected sooner which means their chance of survival is greater.
::sigh::
Am I accidently typing in French? Russian?
Show me anything that substantiates your claim that people in the US with Stage3/4 cancers fare better than others with Stage 2 cancers in other countries. You made the claim. I keep asking for proof and you keep dancing around the issue. If you can't BACK it up, just admit you MADE it up.
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