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Scenario: You, happily married with one healthy child (only routine doctor visits and attention) and a working spouse. You're successful, making well above the average wage. Your neighbor, nice fellow that he is, has six children, the youngest being a retard with extensive medical problems. You're taxed out the wazoo and he, not making nearly as much, is not. Yet he draws heavily upon the state for very expensive medical care and other attention for his brood.
Where is your benefit for contributing so much more into the system than you will ever draw out? What do you see as his obligation, having irresponsibly bred a like a rabbit, and burdening the system far out of proportion to what he will ever be able to put into it?
Do you think any of this is fair, or are you of the hive mentality that thinks it's a wonderful world?
Would you ever draw a line anywhere on behavior which burdens the collective unreasonably?
Do you understand the difference between "want" and "need"?
What is the responsibility of a democratically-elected government to its' populace?
FWIW, I do not have a problem with taxes that benefit ALL equally (or somewhat close to equally).
My benefit is not seeing my neighbour and his children suffer through lack of health care (or indeed any other benefit they might receive). I don't want to see innocent children suffer just because their parents can't, or even won't, make ends meet.
In the scenario I am happily married with one healthy child - what if my next child is born disabled and needs constant care so I am no longer able to work and make a good wage? Anyone's life can take a turn for the worse and anyone can end up relying on the system that they have been paying into all their life.
I myself have drawn very heavily on the State medical care, despite being a basically healthy adult I had a very complicated pregnancy that could not have been predicted - I can't imagine having to go through all that while at the same time worrying about how to pay for it all.
Scenario: You, happily married with one healthy child (only routine doctor visits and attention) and a working spouse. You're successful, making well above the average wage. Your neighbor, nice fellow that he is, has six children, the youngest being a retard with extensive medical problems. You're taxed out the wazoo and he, not making nearly as much, is not. Yet he draws heavily upon the state for very expensive medical care and other attention for his brood.
Where is your benefit for contributing so much more into the system than you will ever draw out? What do you see as his obligation, having irresponsibly bred a like a rabbit, and burdening the system far out of proportion to what he will ever be able to put into it?
Do you think any of this is fair, or are you of the hive mentality that thinks it's a wonderful world?
Would you ever draw a line anywhere on behavior which burdens the collective unreasonably?
Do you understand the difference between "want" and "need"?
What is the responsibility of a democratically-elected government to its' populace?
FWIW, I do not have a problem with taxes that benefit ALL equally (or somewhat close to equally).
Because tomorrow, my healthy child could be diagnosed with cystic fibrosis or I could (and did) get diagnosed with Stage IV cancer or my husband could get hit by a bus. Suddenly, one parent either can't work or will need to drastically reduce workload in order to accomodate caretaking roles (either for themselves or for their child). Just because you're not being benefited equally now doesn't mean you won't down the line. That well above average wage doesn't seem so high when you get sick.
I say this as someone who didn't qualify for any government benefits while I was facing cancer myself. Because of my limited time in the workforce, I did not qualify for assistance. It benefits me to know that my tax money helps prevent others from having to go through what I did. No one should have to get 6 hours of chemo on a Friday and be back in the office at 9AM on Monday morning for a 40-60 hour work week despite being in severe pain, fatigue, and all the other fun chemo brings. It just made me sicker and left me with more long term effects that we'll ALL have to pay for in the long run.
One thing to keep in mind though, although access to health care is a necessity to a healthy life, healthy life it self is a luxury people in many countries cannot afford.
Of course! I'm cool with paying for others' health care. I'm also cool with my taxes subsidizing higher education, even though I no longer go to school. I'm cool with affordable daycare, even though I never had to use it. I'm cool with extended maternity leave, even though I can no longer have kids. These things create a stable, healthy, happy populace, and that leads to a strong, productive society.
Too bad so many don't seem to get this ...
Last edited by JohnnyMack; 10-20-2013 at 04:57 AM..
Scenario: You, happily married with one healthy child (only routine doctor visits and attention) and a working spouse. You're successful, making well above the average wage. Your neighbor, nice fellow that he is, has six children, the youngest being a retard with extensive medical problems. You're taxed out the wazoo and he, not making nearly as much, is not. Yet he draws heavily upon the state for very expensive medical care and other attention for his brood.
Where is your benefit for contributing so much more into the system than you will ever draw out? What do you see as his obligation, having irresponsibly bred a like a rabbit, and burdening the system far out of proportion to what he will ever be able to put into it?
Do you think any of this is fair, or are you of the hive mentality that thinks it's a wonderful world?
Would you ever draw a line anywhere on behavior which burdens the collective unreasonably?
Do you understand the difference between "want" and "need"?
What is the responsibility of a democratically-elected government to its' populace?
FWIW, I do not have a problem with taxes that benefit ALL equally (or somewhat close to equally).
First, calling a child a "retard" is awful, and I am not part of the PC Police.
Secondly, fair doesn't always mean the same.
I think others have said it well, that the benefit is to seeing that people don't suffer.
My benefit is not seeing my neighbour and his children suffer through lack of health care (or indeed any other benefit they might receive). I don't want to see innocent children suffer just because their parents can't, or even won't, make ends meet.
You left out the part that matters... Let me correct your statement...
"my benefit is not seeing my neighbor and his children suffer, and not have to do anything myself to correct it."
Quote:
In the scenario I am happily married with one healthy child - what if my next child is born disabled and needs constant care so I am no longer able to work and make a good wage? Anyone's life can take a turn for the worse and anyone can end up relying on the system that they have been paying into all their life.
There is no "system you paid into". There's giving politicians money to waste politically, or there's being financially prudent. You seem to prefer funding politicians to being prudent.
Quote:
I myself have drawn very heavily on the State medical care, despite being a basically healthy adult I had a very complicated pregnancy that could not have been predicted - I can't imagine having to go through all that while at the same time worrying about how to pay for it all.
You left out the part that matters... Let me correct your statement...
"my benefit is not seeing my neighbor and his children suffer, and not have to do anything myself to correct it."
There is no "system you paid into". There's giving politicians money to waste politically, or there's being financially prudent. You seem to prefer funding politicians to being prudent.
The bold is what responsible people do.
By paying taxes I am doing something myself to correct it. It is much more cost effective for everyone to contribute in taxes and the State to then use that tax money to provide health and social services than for individual people to help other individual people directly out of their own income.
Maybe your politicians waste your tax money but I feel that tax money here is mostly well spent. Not everyone can be financially prudent enough to extent that they can cover whatever might happen to them. Some people are just not intelligent or skilled enough to get a well paying job (and we need people working the lower paid jobs anyway) so its pretty ridiculous to just say be financially prudent and be done with it. Life is much more complicated than that.
How does worrying about something make someone responsible? I don't have to worry about how I will pay for my healthcare if I get ill but that doesn't make me irresponsible, it has nothing to do with responsibility, just circumstances.
First, calling a child a "retard" is awful, and I am not part of the PC Police.
Secondly, fair doesn't always mean the same.
I think others have said it well, that the benefit is to seeing that people don't suffer.
You have serendipitously pointed to the very crux of the problem. This poster used the derogatory word "retard" to describe a developmentally challenged person because that's the way he thinks of them, in a decidedly derogatory fashion.
This is the type of person who considers himself above the possibility of ever having to deal with something as mundane as an unforeseen health problem. His world is all ordered and arranged with all contingencies covered, so fuggg the rest of the people on the other side of the fence.
He'll get his one day and will very probably scream louder than anyone "where's the compassion?"
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