U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-17-2013, 11:10 AM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,320,747 times
Reputation: 1833

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
Yes 9/11 could have literally been prevented.
No it couldn't have. Because of the way our communications was between our various agencies.

Quote:
Instructors at a Minnesota flying school became suspicious about an Arab student who wanted to learn to fly a 747 in mid air, but not to learn to take off nor land.
That isn't even true.


Quote:
The student claimed to be from France, but would not converse in French with an instructor who happened to be fluent in French. He asked an instructor about how much fuel a 747 carried, and how much damage there would be when it crashed.
no indication that the student in question was going to crash one into the world trade center.

Quote:
After some voice mail runaround, an instructor finally reached an FBI agent on the phone. The instructor warned the agent: "Do you realize that a 747 loaded with fuel can be used as a bomb?"

So what? There was no indication that the plane would be hijacked within our borders. ALL of our plans to thwart an attack would have been for planes that orignated outside hte US, where there would have been time to intercept, and force down, if the PLAN to use them as "bombs" was known. NO ONE KNEW except for the hijackers.


Quote:
The next day, Aug 16, 2001, the FBI arrested the student, Zacarias Moussaoui, because his visa was expired. They had his laptop, but could not search it without a warrant.
funny thing that 4th amendment rights is afforded to anyone on US soil. Even those with expired visas.

Quote:
So the hard drive was not examined before 9/11. The FBI was hoist upon its own proclivity for lying. Senate Intel committee chair Arlen Specter (R, PA) later said that the hard drive had contained a 'veritable roadmap' to the 9/11 attacks. The FBI HQ agent who had stonewalled the investigation later was promoted.
funny thing was that none of the hijackers had information concerning the hijackings till only a few weeks before 9/11 (and not when Mossaoui was "arrested" in August). Bin Laden didn't communicate the exact scenario till only a few days before 9/11 happened.

So what would have they found on the laptop?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-17-2013, 11:14 AM
 
11,614 posts, read 5,878,946 times
Reputation: 1692
TSA would have prevented it.

The hijackers would have been humiliated to death.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 11:27 AM
 
752 posts, read 943,873 times
Reputation: 397
Absolutely preventable it was. Terrorists all together hang before attack in Minneapolis Loring bar by Loring park. Other Muslims that was there was talking all time like "Allah shehids" and so. I, who didn't care at all, was spotting that something is going on. As Americans then, I wasn't US citizen then, I really didn't care. Entire Muslim population of Twin cities know what will happen and nobody say noting.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 11:51 AM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,794 posts, read 14,178,582 times
Reputation: 7949
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
No it couldn't have. Because of the way our communications was between our various agencies.



That isn't even true.




no indication that the student in question was going to crash one into the world trade center.




So what? There was no indication that the plane would be hijacked within our borders. ALL of our plans to thwart an attack would have been for planes that orignated outside hte US, where there would have been time to intercept, and force down, if the PLAN to use them as "bombs" was known. NO ONE KNEW except for the hijackers.




funny thing that 4th amendment rights is afforded to anyone on US soil. Even those with expired visas.



funny thing was that none of the hijackers had information concerning the hijackings till only a few weeks before 9/11 (and not when Mossaoui was "arrested" in August). Bin Laden didn't communicate the exact scenario till only a few days before 9/11 happened.

So what would have they found on the laptop?
Well I provided my source. What is yours? All you do is say "that isn't even true" with zero to back it up. No link, no quote, nothing.

The problem here was not the 4th Amendment, which I fully support. The problem was that FBI HQ decided not to even try to get a warrant.

Again Arlen Specter, who was former chair of the intelligence committee, said that Moussoui's laptop contained a "veritable roadmap" to 9/11. What is your source who says that was not the case?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Calgary, AB
3,401 posts, read 1,906,637 times
Reputation: 1072
Policy and intelligence blunders aside, it probably couldn't have been prevented quite easily after August 6 2001 by putting armed air marshals on every flight. That's a lot of flights. Use soldiers in mufti until you can get enough real marshals together.

Make them Navy pilots and you even have a Plan B if any hijackers manage to kill the pilots.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 01:39 PM
 
Location: NJ
16,774 posts, read 11,698,695 times
Reputation: 10768
It is obvious Obama wants to own an attack larger than the one on 911 as he allows OTMs across the southern border 'at will'.

Obama has already failed to protect us as the fruit of the loom bomber, the times square bomber sucessfully set off exposives which fizzled. They were not caught or otherwise prevented from terrorist acts.

Then there was Benghazi, Army recruiter killed in KY, Ft Hood and Boston. The secrect agencies charged with our safety must have been spending their time listening and reading private communications which they found titilating.

Then the IRS perpetrated a terrorist attack on the conservative voters ultimately resulting in voter supression which stole an election.... a terrorist attck predicted by the DOJ in the form of domestic terrorism.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
55,269 posts, read 53,954,432 times
Reputation: 65232
Not exactly answering your question, but this is a fascinating interview to read, from 1999, published by Esquire Magazine. The interview was filmed and parts of it shown on televison. No one paid much attention at the time.

"The war has just started. The Americans should wait for the answer."

Bin Laden Interview - Esquire Osama bin Laden Interview - Esquire
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Better half of PA
1,391 posts, read 1,035,068 times
Reputation: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kracer View Post
It is obvious Obama wants to own an attack larger than the one on 911 as he allows OTMs across the southern border 'at will'.

Obama has already failed to protect us as the fruit of the loom bomber, the times square bomber sucessfully set off exposives which fizzled. They were not caught or otherwise prevented from terrorist acts.

Then there was Benghazi, Army recruiter killed in KY, Ft Hood and Boston. The secrect agencies charged with our safety must have been spending their time listening and reading private communications which they found titilating.

Then the IRS perpetrated a terrorist attack on the conservative voters ultimately resulting in voter supression which stole an election.... a terrorist attck predicted by the DOJ in the form of domestic terrorism.
Sorry to have to tell you this but in a free society s*** happens sometimes. It ain't fair, it ain't right, and it ain't just. But it is reality.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 02:14 PM
 
5,767 posts, read 10,263,388 times
Reputation: 3813
Quote:
There are rumors that this war led to strengthening of militant groups in Afghanistan, but I am not sure if the rumors hold true.
There are quite a bit more than just "rumors." It's just history. After the Soviet Union withdrew from Afghanistan, the various "mujahideen" factions fought with the government in Kabul, eventually overrunning the city. They fought amongst themselves for several years until the Taliban movement managed to overtake all but the northeastern 10% of the country, at which point it was already late 2001, and you can guess the rest...

Was it a big mistake for the US to go into Pakistan and fund/train/equip the Afghan and foreign anti-Soviet fighters of the late 70's and 1980's? In retrospect, yes, especially since the USSR was already heading for breakup/collapse, and there was no need to dump American resources into a religious "jihad" for that process to complete itself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-17-2013, 03:44 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,320,747 times
Reputation: 1833
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
Well I provided my source. What is yours? All you do is say "that isn't even true" with zero to back it up. No link, no quote, nothing.
You provided nothing. You provided hearsay claims from an unknown instructor at 1 of the many Flight schools that the pilots attended.

And NONE of what he claims could have been used to know exactly what the terrorits were up to, seeing as Bin Laden didn't tell them what they were going to do (the full whole plan) until just a few weeks before, giving them the FINAL plan only a few days before.

Quote:
The problem here was not the 4th Amendment, which I fully support. The problem was that FBI HQ decided not to even try to get a warrant.
Under what EVIDENCE did they have to get a warrant issued? All they had was a guy who was here on an expired visa. That is not a criminal act. so what would be the reason to get a warrant?

There are thousands of aliens on US Soil who are here beyond their Visa's expiration. Are you stating that the FBI should get warrants for all these, just because they all "might" be planning a terrorist attack?

Quote:
Again Arlen Specter, who was former chair of the intelligence committee, said that Moussoui's laptop contained a "veritable roadmap" to 9/11. What is your source who says that was not the case?
Arlen Specter? He wasn't even on Mossaoui's investigation team. That was wholly handled by the FBI upon his capture.

I go by the EVIDENCE that was provided during MOssaoui's trial and the transcripts:
U.S.D.C. Eastern District of Virginia
USA v. Zacarias Moussaoui - Trial Transcripts

Such "roadmap" would have been argued and presented.


And how 9/11 could have been prevented? by more surveillance. MORE so than we have now. This is the agreement between ALL sides of the government and media, including past senators and some military officers.

So if these people are saying that more surveillance would have prevented 9/11, then that means WE didn't have enough to GO on to predict or even have fore knowledge of it going to happen.

We got a unspecified threat, from an individual who had sent more than a hundred threats against the US since 1993. Do you want hte US to jump at every time a boy cries wolf? If that happens, then we'll be in more of a gulag than the Jews during WWII. Do you want that type of America?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. | Please obey Forum Rules | Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top