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Old 11-21-2013, 08:02 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,193,725 times
Reputation: 18824

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
Even if he personally thinks he's being ingenuous, he is obviously being manipulated to say these things.


Probably he knows no better, trapped in the propaganda hole in Cuba.
How is he "obviously" being manipulated to say anything? What's obvious about it? How can you possibly know such a thing?

You can only speculate and without more information than what i have (which is NONE), your assertions are just blind conjecture. Wishful thinking might even be more aptly applied to your assertion.

And how do you know what he knows relative to if he "knows no better" or not? Cuba isn't nearly as impenetrable as the Soviet Union was, and they had dissidents and people that knew and understood what democracy was...or at least they had enough knowledge that even if they'd never heard of democracy, they damn sure knew that they weren't living under it!

Cuba gets 3 million tourists a year, and they're only 100 or so miles from our coast. You're gonna tell me that he can't POSSIBLY know of other worlds beyond his own?

Please...stop it.
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Old 11-21-2013, 09:17 AM
 
17,291 posts, read 29,399,972 times
Reputation: 8691
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
How is he "obviously" being manipulated to say anything? What's obvious about it? How can you possibly know such a thing?

You can only speculate and without more information than what i have (which is NONE), your assertions are just blind conjecture. Wishful thinking might even be more aptly applied to your assertion.

And how do you know what he knows relative to if he "knows no better" or not? Cuba isn't nearly as impenetrable as the Soviet Union was, and they had dissidents and people that knew and understood what democracy was...or at least they had enough knowledge that even if they'd never heard of democracy, they damn sure knew that they weren't living under it!

Cuba gets 3 million tourists a year, and they're only 100 or so miles from our coast. You're gonna tell me that he can't POSSIBLY know of other worlds beyond his own?

Please...stop it.
Either he is dumb, or he is being manipulated. I am trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Blaming the US' policy for his mother's decision? Really?

I'm sure he is "marked" in that it defines his youth and made him an at-home celebrity, but it is YOU who needs to STOP trying to cast this kids' words in a light other than what is apparently obvious to propagandize the situation.


IN case YOU haven't noticed, nobody in the US outside of Miami basically care about Cuba anymore (and that lobby exacts control to keep embargo in place).... but being "anti-American" and "fighting the Yankee imperialist pigs and supporting the revolution" IS still a part of Cuban mythos for some unknown reason.
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Old 11-21-2013, 09:59 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,193,725 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
Either he is dumb, or he is being manipulated. I am trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Blaming the US' policy for his mother's decision? Really?

I'm sure he is "marked" in that it defines his youth and made him an at-home celebrity, but it is YOU who needs to STOP trying to cast this kids' words in a light other than what is apparently obvious to propagandize the situation.


IN case YOU haven't noticed, nobody in the US outside of Miami basically care about Cuba anymore (and that lobby exacts control to keep embargo in place).... but being "anti-American" and "fighting the Yankee imperialist pigs and supporting the revolution" IS still a part of Cuban mythos for some unknown reason.
LMAO...hardly. Yeah, the government still tries to perpetuate that stuff, but the average Cuban hasn't fallen for that b.s. line in at least a few decades.

Moreover, I think you wildly underestimate the right wing resolve to keep Cuba under an embargo, and it's not just the usual myrmidons in Miami either.

If Obama had the power to TOTALLY change U.S. policy tomorrow by ending the embargo and resuming full trade and government to government diplomacy, Fox News would have a meltdown and their station would crash. Hannity, O'Reilly, Kilmeade, Hume, Krauthammer, Baird, and Kelly would all be hospitalized with massive strokes.

Come on...don't front..you know I'm right.
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Old 11-21-2013, 11:11 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,879 posts, read 77,491,785 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
LMAO...hardly. Yeah, the government still tries to perpetuate that stuff, but the average Cuban hasn't fallen for that b.s. line in at least a few decades.

Moreover, I think you wildly underestimate the right wing resolve to keep Cuba under an embargo, and it's not just the usual myrmidons in Miami either.

If Obama had the power to TOTALLY change U.S. policy tomorrow by ending the embargo and resuming full trade and government to government diplomacy, Fox News would have a meltdown and their station would crash. Hannity, O'Reilly, Kilmeade, Hume, Krauthammer, Baird, and Kelly would all be hospitalized with massive strokes.

Come on...don't front..you know I'm right.
While it may be true that some folks in the media would squeal if the policy changed, the majority of Americans think the embargo is ridiculous and serves no purpose whatsoever.

When Europeans trade with Cuba, and are tourists there . . . it does look meaningless that the USA, only 90 miles away, still has this embargo going.

So I think you are wrong. Everyone I have spoken to about the embargo (in the last 20 years) has said . . . time to lift it and stop with the Castro is Satan stuff.
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Old 11-22-2013, 09:58 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,193,725 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
While it may be true that some folks in the media would squeal if the policy changed, the majority of Americans think the embargo is ridiculous and serves no purpose whatsoever.

When Europeans trade with Cuba, and are tourists there . . . it does look meaningless that the USA, only 90 miles away, still has this embargo going.

So I think you are wrong. Everyone I have spoken to about the embargo (in the last 20 years) has said . . . time to lift it and stop with the Castro is Satan stuff.
Sorry, but I don't think conservatives dislike the embargo. I've seen little evidence of that.
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:00 PM
 
5,261 posts, read 4,155,515 times
Reputation: 2264
I was always amused by the self-described "family values" folks who thought Elian should be permanently separated from his father to live with those demented relatives of his in Florida.
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:02 PM
 
7,359 posts, read 5,462,865 times
Reputation: 3142
Quote:
Originally Posted by camaro69 View Post
Wait, so now it's our fault that his mother died at sea.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"They were very sad times for me, which marked me for my whole life. I was never given the chance to have a moment to think about my mother, who as a result of that (U.S.) Cuban Adjustment Act died at sea," the now-19-year-old Gonzalez said last weekend during a Union of Young Communists event.

Elián González: My Time In The U.S. 'Marked Me For My Whole Life' | Fox News Latino
We forced his mother to get on the boat and try to come here?
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Native Floridian, USA
5,297 posts, read 7,630,795 times
Reputation: 7480
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
Janet Reno showed more resolve and toughness than you can imagine. You're simply dead wrong on that one. The easier decision was to let him stay. It was also the wrong decision.
I agree with this post whole heartedly. She wasn't a pushover in many ways and took full responsibility for the Waco disaster. Hillary Clinton could learn something about class and responsibility from Janet Reno.
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