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Old 12-04-2013, 03:37 PM
 
39,020 posts, read 23,146,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
You contradict yourself. First you say pregnancy is horrible and women know it, than you say women should be able to have sex anytime they want. Doesn't that make the woman stupid? Having sex can result in pregnancy. You make it seem it's just a innate drive one can't control. But so many now use abortion as birth control so who cares. Why not take care in the first place and not go through either?
Not at all. An unwanted pregnancy is horrible. And women should have the say in who they have sex with, when and where. As long as their sexual partner is consenting. Exactly the same as men.

It is an innate drive. And women and men have the same obligations of control. The problem is that in our society, there has been an ongoing myth invented and promoted by the founders of the patriarchal religions, that women shouldn't have a say in who, when and where they have sex (men should decide for them), and that women shouldn't enjoy sex (sex is for men to enjoy, and women are for men to enjoy).

Women do take care in the first place. The instances of pregnancies resulting from sex is miniscule. We have a lot of sex going on. That the majority of those pregnancies are unplanned is a function of just how much sex we are having. But men and women do make mistakes, birth control is not 100%. Even women who've had tubal ligations, and men who've had vasectomies, end up with unplanned (obviously) pregnancies.

Human beings are going to have sex. And pregnancy will result. And sometimes that pregnancy is unwanted. If the woman is in a secure and healthy relationship with her partner, I think they should make the decisions regarding an unwanted pregnancy together. Regretfully, women aren't always in secure and healthy relationships, and in those cases the decision belongs to her.

The decision to continue or to end a pregnancy is a difficult thing to consider. Dismissing that fact by arguing that "so many" use abortion as birth control is about demeaning the women who do choose abortion. Instead of demeaning those women, people who are truly pro-life should be addressing why women choose abortion. What can we as a society do to make pregnancy and childbirth safer for women and their families? What can we as a society do to address the costs and burdens that pregnancy and childbirth and childrearing pose? When we focus on abortion as a bad thing, we end up trying to make the women who have abortions out as the bad guys. That's not true. Women who choose abortion are making that choice for a reason. And the reasons are compelling. They have to be, because the majority of women choosing abortion already have children. They understand the joys of motherhood, the miracle of life, the wonder of watching a little one discover the world. They know what abortion entails. So the reasons they choose to have that abortion outweigh the joy, the miracle, the wonder.

The pro-life movement can demonize women, but that won't address the reasons why women choose abortion. And until they address those reasons, they can't really call themselves pro-life.

I believe that women are intelligent, capable, moral, and responsible. I believe that the decision to have an abortion is heart-rending. It's not the woman that is the problem. It's our society. It's what we do to children after their born. It's what we do to women who are pregnant. It's what we as a society demand from women, that we don't demand from men.

 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
28,173 posts, read 43,452,271 times
Reputation: 18562
Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
The web site links to other sites, sites in Argentina.
Yeah, pro-life and Catholic sites, from what I saw. Do you even read the link descriptions, or just go "hey, that backs up my position - good 'nuff!!"

Quote:
Plus Life News was spot on true when they reported on Kermit Gosnell and his abortion clinic of horrors. You don't have to look if it troubles you but others want to see and be informed about the truth.
I have no idea what that story is/was about, so cannot judge it... but I'm sure even if it was based in truth, they made sure to inject their usual "abortion is evil, no matter who or why is getting one" and "all women on birth control are hos" stances. I'm quite familiar with their tactics, mostly thanks to you and a few others on this forum who keep pushing their agenda.
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:39 PM
 
39,020 posts, read 23,146,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
Lol, pretty much.



None of this makes one iota of difference, in this case, for these women. They should be punished just as any random attacker (e.g., a man humiliating and spraying paint on a woman) would be.

And if they think otherwise, they are not even feminists. Just sexists wanting a better-sounding label.
I agree that they should be punished for spray-painting these men. Just out of curiosity, what do you think their punishment should be? And what do you think the punishment should be for the Catholic men that attacked the Jewish temple? And what do you think the punishment should be for the Catholic Church and its continuing discrimination?
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:39 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 12,823,883 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weltschmerz View Post
What about them? If your faith is strong, you should have no problem with these poor, poor little murdered baby souls flying up to heaven to reside in the loving arms of Jesus.
You have yet to address this.
I suspect you won't address it now.
What about the souls of the women who abort and those who are involved in the abortions. Are you concerned about them?
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:41 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 12,823,883 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
I agree that they should be punished for spray-painting these men. Just out of curiosity, what do you think their punishment should be? And what do you think the punishment should be for the Catholic men that attacked the Jewish temple? And what do you think the punishment should be for the Catholic Church and its continuing discrimination?
From what I know they don't discriminate. Do you have the link?
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
28,173 posts, read 43,452,271 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
What about the souls of the women who abort and those who are involved in the abortions. Are you concerned about them?
If one believed in the concept of a soul, and also believed that abortion was a "sin," they might be concerned. For the rest of us, I would say probably not.

Do you really not get that everyone has different beliefs? And that yours might not be the ONLY good or correct ones? Nah, never mind.
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:43 PM
 
39,020 posts, read 23,146,013 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
Do you have the link to that attack?

What harm did the Church do to women? Oppose abortions? What about the female babies that are killed in abortions?
I often read posts about how we should stop Muslims from entering the United States, and one of the reasons often cited is how Islam discriminated against women. When you ask what harm does the Catholic Church's discrimination do to women, it's the same harm that Islam's discrimination does to women.

Islam women believe in their religion, and in the limitations imposed on women by their religion.

Christian women believe in their religion, and in the limitations imposed on women by their religion.

The struggle for equality is a battle against those limitations.
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:45 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 12,823,883 times
Reputation: 5420
Default Google is our friend---read the site you want but I bet you will pick the one that favors your views LOL

https://www.google.com/search?q=Argi...ient=firefox-a
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:46 PM
 
39,020 posts, read 23,146,013 times
Reputation: 12146
Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
From what I know they don't discriminate. Do you have the link?
Can women be priests?
 
Old 12-04-2013, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
28,173 posts, read 43,452,271 times
Reputation: 18562
Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
Nice try, but I already did a Google search (you think a Librarian can't use Google? LMAO!!). At least on the first couple of pages, EVERY SINGLE SOURCE is either biased or simply a portal to the LifeSiteNews article. Did you read the results, or just do what so many of my patrons do - type in some key words, and pass off the first couple of hits as "sources."
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