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Old 12-04-2013, 09:38 AM
 
71,504 posts, read 30,085,054 times
Reputation: 14083

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
Are you sure? You`ve got plans to "man up" somewhere down the road and stop with the never ending crying about losing 2 elections to this guy? I think most of you boys would do well to keep that maternity coverage.
Pretty typical here. Rather than address the point you want to make it about the participant. Is it really this difficult to defend?

I supported Obama's position when he was still candidate Obama. What he promised as candidate Obama is not what we got when he became president Obama. We would not be having this debate if people had been allowed to keep their old policies as Obama promised. We would not be having this discussion if the costs of insurance was going down as opposed to up like Obama promised. We would not be having this discussion if we had debated this in the open and not behind closed door like Obama promised we would.

Do you want to discuss the problems that constantly promising something that never happens has on the discussion or do you prefer to discuss me?
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
19,428 posts, read 9,756,057 times
Reputation: 7535
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogdad View Post
If you like your plan and your Doctor you can keep them.

Opps not so much. LOL


Obamacare: More than 2 million people getting booted from existing health insurance plans - CBS News
If the company policy does not cover the minimums, then no you can't. Just like if the water company tries to sell contaminated water but can't do so legally, there are minimum standards they have to adhere to.

And no one can force a doctor to accept any insurance plan. Pre ACA I had to change doctors because his office decided not to accept my plan anymore. This is not something new.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:43 AM
 
71,504 posts, read 30,085,054 times
Reputation: 14083
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Because when it comes to insurance, you don't know what you'll need until the need actually arises.
As noted, I know I will never need maternity care.

Quote:
The not buying insurance until needed thing is covered by the mandate. You have to buy before it is needed or pay a fine.
If you get something not covered by your policy, and can not pay out of pocket, do you just walk out of the hospital and say no thanks? No. you get treated, and MY insurance rates go up to cover the hospitals costs.
Last year hospitals had $41 BILLION dollars of unpaid treatments. Do you really think they eat that loss?
Nothing has been done to address costs to others that are not paid by them. You watch, the fines are unlikely going to kick in. Then if they do the people will be so pissed that they are going to vote for whoever promises to end them.

Quote:
Think of it like a store. A pack of gum costs 50 cents currently. If the store has a lot of loss due to theft, the price of that pack of gum goes up. Even if I never stole a pack of gum, I will be paying more for that pack of gum because someone else did.
Millions upon millions will not be able to afford insurance. We are either going to pay it for them in which case I am still paying for the stolen gum or they are going to just continue to walk into the ER with no insurance and we are not going to turn them away.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:48 AM
 
14,298 posts, read 7,734,169 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by chucksnee View Post
And from CNN....so there goes the left's "how about a reputable source" BS....

It will be interesting how the left will spin this:

MODS, can you add the popcorn eating smilie?
No one is even surprised by this any more, we know how despicable Reid and the senate dems are.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
19,428 posts, read 9,756,057 times
Reputation: 7535
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
As noted, I know I will never need maternity care.



Nothing has been done to address costs to others that are not paid by them. You watch, the fines are unlikely going to kick in. Then if they do the people will be so pissed that they are going to vote for whoever promises to end them.



Millions upon millions will not be able to afford insurance. We are either going to pay it for them in which case I am still paying for the stolen gum or they are going to just continue to walk into the ER with no insurance and we are not going to turn them away.
And I know I will never need ED treatment, or prostate cancer screenings or treatment, yet my insurance has covered it for years. I can not pick out the pieces that there is no possible way I could ever use. That is kind of the point of an insurance pool. More people share the cost of ALL possible conditions that could arise.

No, not everyone will be covered, only a single payer plan would do that, but more will be, thus lessening the amount of "theft".
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:52 AM
 
9,112 posts, read 4,533,296 times
Reputation: 3730
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Every policy has mandated minimum standards, just like many other things in our daily lives. If your policy meets those standards you can keep it, just like my policy exceeded the requirements and I kept it.

What other minimum standards do you not like? Clean drinking water standards? Safe building standards? What about the standard that I can not burn tires on my property, or open a pig farm in my back yard in a residential neighborhood? There are minimum standards for just about every business transaction.
What makes you think all federal health plan options include the minimum standards ? They don't. As a large employer, the fed gov't. doesn't have to submit to those mandates.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:56 AM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
60,440 posts, read 30,688,107 times
Reputation: 12876
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
He should be murdered? Nice.



We always could write it up in history as, he gave the ultimate sacrifice for freedom.
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Old 12-04-2013, 09:56 AM
 
71,504 posts, read 30,085,054 times
Reputation: 14083
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
And I know I will never need ED treatment, or prostate cancer screenings or treatment, yet my insurance has covered it for years. I can not pick out the pieces that there is no possible way I could ever use. That is kind of the point of an insurance pool. More people share the cost of ALL possible conditions that could arise.
I can choose to not add a flood rider to my homeowners insurance. I can choose to buy simple liability on my vehicle. I can decide not to pay extra for towing. Why should I pay extra for towing so that others that want it pays less?

Quote:
No, not everyone will be covered, only a single payer plan would do that, but more will be, thus lessening the amount of "theft".
Today there are fewer with insurance than there was in September. Wanting me to pay up front for your insurance is still "theft". How is it theft if I have to pay for it after service as opposed to me paying for it before coverage?
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Old 12-04-2013, 10:06 AM
 
14,298 posts, read 7,734,169 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Because when it comes to insurance, you don't know what you'll need until the need actually arises.
A young, single male knows he will not need to cover birth control, OBGYN, pediatrics, breast cancer, old age illnesses like dementia, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
The not buying insurance until needed thing is covered by the mandate. You have to buy before it is needed or pay a fine.
If you get something not covered by your policy, and can not pay out of pocket, do you just walk out of the hospital and say no thanks? No. you get treated, and MY insurance rates go up to cover the hospitals costs.
Last year hospitals had $41 BILLION dollars of unpaid treatments. Do you really think they eat that loss?
So tell me, where do these ObamaCare fines go to? Do they go to the insurance companies, the hospitals, or the doctors? Or do they go into the deep, gapping maw of the tax and spend, waste and fraud, federal government? Those fines do nothing about the $41 billion in unpaid treatments, they still continue. And with all the new taxes and regulations in the ACA those treatments will cost more too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Think of it like a store. A pack of gum costs 50 cents currently. If the store has a lot of loss due to theft, the price of that pack of gum goes up. Even if I never stole a pack of gum, I will be paying more for that pack of gum because someone else did.
And if I never, ever buy gum, why should I be tasked funding your appetite for gum? BTW, the ACA is not about lower health care costs, it's only purpose is to force everyone to buy over priced, fully loaded, all the bells and whistles, one-size-fits-all, soup to nuts, health care insurance, from big corporations.
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Old 12-04-2013, 10:12 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
19,428 posts, read 9,756,057 times
Reputation: 7535
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama View Post
What makes you think all federal health plan options include the minimum standards ? They don't. As a large employer, the fed gov't. doesn't have to submit to those mandates.
ALL insurance policies now have to conform to minimum standards.
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