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Old 12-06-2013, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Austin
11,096 posts, read 6,288,038 times
Reputation: 11995

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2tall View Post
Giving money to people that don't know how to handle money doesn't do anything to reduce or eliminate poverty.
Yes it would. Giving each welfare person $21,000 a year would place a family of four well above the poverty line. Poverty would be over. According to the 2013 Federal Poverty Guidelines, the poverty level for a family of four is $23,950. The total of $84,000 is roughly 380 percent of the federal poverty guidelines.
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Old 12-06-2013, 10:52 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia
11,832 posts, read 9,896,201 times
Reputation: 7983
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2tall View Post
Giving money to people that don't know how to handle money doesn't do anything to reduce or eliminate poverty.
You're right-we probably shouldn't have given all those Trillions of Dollars in US taxpayer money to multi-national and foreign Corporations via bailouts.

It isn't only poor people that don't know how to handle money.
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Old 12-06-2013, 10:58 AM
 
18,215 posts, read 9,982,767 times
Reputation: 17746
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
he pulled himself out of poverty. but he is right, poverty is a result of laziness. if people dont want to put forth the effort required to get out of poverty, they wont get out of poverty. and in the end we will never get rid of poverty in any country. the poor will always be with us.
So he's precisely saying his parents or grandparents were lazy--otherwise he would not have been born into their poverty-- but he was not.

I guess he's also saying that someone who put 30 years into becoming the best expert machinist he could be--and then at age 48 with kids in school and with the greatest income obligations he'd ever have--saw all job possibilities for expert machinists suddenly vanish across the country...yeah, that guy was lazy.

All the people who worked for Enron and invested their retirement funds into Enron...yeah, they were all lazy.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:01 AM
 
18,215 posts, read 9,982,767 times
Reputation: 17746
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
They aren't stopping fraud. It's gotten very easy to have a disability now and be given welfare handouts, we've got more people on welfare handouts than ever before. Most people on welfare handouts are able bodied and have IQs over 70, they could do some kind of work but don't want to work. It's absurd that the taxpayers are less than half of the population now.
Actually, most people on welfare are either children or the elderly.

Most of the rest are only on welfare for short periods. The problem with low-end jobs these days is that they are usually also short-term and rarely are bottom rungs of reliable career ladders. Work six months and, no, you don't get promoted, you get fired so they can hire someone else at that wage.

In the interim between such jobs, the person is on welfare.

There are two great fallacies, one of the Left and one of the Right. The first great fallacy is that everyone is capable of going to college and becoming a doctor. The other great fallacy is that everyone is capable of being an independent entrepreneur and becoming Bill Gates.

The truth is that the vast majority of people are average schmoes who truly were not born with the ability to do either. They can be trained to work for someone who does, and that's the best the averge person can attain. A great lie of "American exceptinalism" is that all Americans are exceptional.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:11 AM
 
793 posts, read 1,071,021 times
Reputation: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2e1m5a View Post
You're right-we probably shouldn't have given all those Trillions of Dollars in US taxpayer money to multi-national and foreign Corporations via bailouts.

It isn't only poor people that don't know how to handle money.
I agree with this as well.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:13 AM
 
7,372 posts, read 4,466,078 times
Reputation: 3126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Who would do the work of the government workers?
That assumes the government workers are actually doing work. If you can end a problem that the government worker is trying to manage, then you don't need the worker anymore.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:15 AM
 
30,025 posts, read 15,370,691 times
Reputation: 15727
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Who would do the work of the government workers?
The market would take over. Also, tax cuts for the job creators.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:19 AM
 
7,372 posts, read 4,466,078 times
Reputation: 3126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
The truth is that the vast majority of people are average schmoes who truly were not born with the ability to do either. They can be trained to work for someone who does, and that's the best the averge person can attain. A great lie of "American exceptinalism" is that all Americans are exceptional.
American exceptionalism has nothing to do with Americans as individual people. It has to do with America itself. It says that America provides freedom and opportunity so people can work to reach their potential. It doesn't say that every American has great potential. Or that people are guaranteed to reach that potential. Only that if they do have it, America provides the opportunity to attempt reaching it.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:23 AM
 
18,215 posts, read 9,982,767 times
Reputation: 17746
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2 View Post
American exceptionalism has nothing to do with Americans as individual people. It has to do with America itself. It says that America provides freedom and opportunity so people can work to reach their potential. It doesn't say that every American has great potential. Or that people are guaranteed to reach that potential. Only that if they do have it, America provides the opportunity to attempt reaching it.
I said: " A great lie of 'American exceptinalism' is that all Americans are exceptional."

There is a distinction between having said "A great lie" rather than "The great lie."
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:24 AM
 
18,215 posts, read 9,982,767 times
Reputation: 17746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
The market would take over. Also, tax cuts for the job creators.
Ah, yes, an acolyte of the great holy religion of The Market.

Job creators already get tax cuts, which is a great idea, except that job eliminators get greater benefits from their god The Market.
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