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Old 12-06-2013, 01:49 PM
 
Location: Orange County, CA
3,730 posts, read 5,094,063 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZcardinal402 View Post
Mandela brought the country together for a while.
Mandela the great unifier? Might want to ask Mangosuthu Buthelazi and the Inkatha Freedom Party about that.
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:56 PM
 
2,538 posts, read 3,888,776 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Actually South Africa is usually considered a 2nd World nation (those terms are non-PC now, by the way) in the same grouping as South Korea, Spain and Taiwan.

This thread will degenerate and be closed in fairly short order.
Taiwan, South Korea, and Spain are definitely not 2nd world.

BTW, 2nd world really really a term, unless you're talking about the Soviet Union and the eastern block.
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:58 PM
 
6,273 posts, read 6,111,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
Yeah, the black population should just have peacefully voted for anti-apartheid politicians. Oh, wait - they couldn't vote. That sorta did reduce their options...
So their first political movement could be asking for the right to vote... And then vote the apartheid politicians out, or change the constitution etc.
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:59 PM
 
6,273 posts, read 6,111,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
A country is made up by its inhabitants. When the majority of the inhabitants are kept firmly under a minority's thumb, that's a problem. That, in fact, makes the country worse by any decent person's yardstick. (I'd prefer to say a country is made up by its citizens, but black South Africans weren't even citizens, remember?)
Hong Kong was ruled by British too. However the Chinese waited till 1997 to take it back. They could have done that much earlier, but they chose not to.
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Old 12-06-2013, 02:03 PM
 
29,874 posts, read 15,230,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
So their first political movement could be asking for the right to vote...
Oh, that's brilliant! The government that disenfranchised and forcefully relocated them in the first place would surely bow to the force of arguments.
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Old 12-06-2013, 02:09 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,156 posts, read 39,236,941 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Taiwan, South Korea, and Spain are definitely not 2nd world.

BTW, 2nd world really really a term, unless you're talking about the Soviet Union and the eastern block.
They're not 1st World (US, England, France, Japan), they're not 3rd World (most of Africa and Asia that aren't dirt poor), so most put them in the 2nd.

OK, I see that the definitions have been changed because of the ****stans in SW Asia.
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Old 12-06-2013, 02:10 PM
 
6,273 posts, read 6,111,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
Oh, that's brilliant! The government that disenfranchised and forcefully relocated them in the first place would surely bow to the force of arguments.
Yes, because the government is made of people, who change their mind along time. If white people in the US did not change their mind, do you really think blacks could succeed? Things are all connected.

There can be international pressure too.
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Old 12-06-2013, 02:34 PM
 
29,874 posts, read 15,230,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
Yes, because the government is made of people, who change their mind along time.
That really is your solution? Wait for the despots to stop being despotic? And in the menatime, meekly accept the random imprisonments, the beatings, the inferior schools and hospitals, the forced relocation, being stripped of citizenship, vote, voice?

Remind me to not count on you if things turn ugly.
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Old 12-06-2013, 02:47 PM
 
6,273 posts, read 6,111,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
That really is your solution? Wait for the despots to stop being despotic? And in the menatime, meekly accept the random imprisonments, the beatings, the inferior schools and hospitals, the forced relocation, being stripped of citizenship, vote, voice?

Remind me to not count on you if things turn ugly.
Well, there are many ways to change the status quo.
Some prefer a quick revolution, others prefer a slow reform.
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Old 12-06-2013, 03:10 PM
 
44,621 posts, read 43,151,983 times
Reputation: 14410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
In the 1950s, South Africa was even better than now is, compared to other African countries
For whom? Black people were being treated horribly and subjected to a dictatorship.
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