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Old 12-11-2013, 06:33 PM
 
3,550 posts, read 2,555,824 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Not at all. A person of any religion is allowed to open any business they want. They simply have to follow the same laws as everyone else.
Maybe you don't understand the definition of ban. IF one is allowed, then they are not banned.
do you understand that a religious person who helps a same gender "wedding" by following this law is no longer religious.

to illustrate the point (in a way that you might understand)

let's say the New York would make a law that requires all bakeries to use lard (not kosher)
would Orthodox Jewish bakeries have to follow that law?

 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:37 PM
 
3,550 posts, read 2,555,824 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
No one is forcing anyone to open a business. No one is forcing anyone to offer wedding cakes for sale. IF one CHOOSES to open a business and sell wedding cakes, then they can not discriminate. Don't offer wedding cakes for sale, and you don't have to sell them to gays.
I'll translate the Colorado Law into other words

No Religious Person is allowed to open a bakery thats sells wedding cakes, be a caterer of wedding, a wedding photographer etc.

wouldn't you agree that who ever is in favor of that law is a bigot.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:39 PM
 
3,550 posts, read 2,555,824 times
Reputation: 477
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
That is discrimination based on the sexual orientation of the people the wedding cake is for.
let's says both of these gays considered themselves bisexual.


is it still discrimination based on sexual orientation.

remember it has nothing to do with their orientation because I would provide the cake to both of if they were really getting married to 2 other people.


In short discrimination has to be on a person not a event
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,202,347 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Jew View Post
do you understand that a religious person who helps a same gender "wedding" by following this law is no longer religious.

to illustrate the point (in a way that you might understand)

let's say the New York would make a law that requires all bakeries to use lard (not kosher)
would Orthodox Jewish bakeries have to follow that law?
Then don't sell wedding cakes. Sell bagels, and muffing, and birthday cakes. There are many baked goods to choose from. If YOUR religious beliefs prevent you from following the laws related to doing business, then you have a CHOICE to make. No banning involved. I do not know of any laws that say what a business MUST use or sell, but only what they can not use or sell. Please name one.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,202,347 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Jew View Post
I'll translate the Colorado Law into other words

No Religious Person is allowed to open a bakery thats sells wedding cakes, be a caterer of wedding, a wedding photographer etc.

wouldn't you agree that who ever is in favor of that law is a bigot.
Nope. that is not what the law says, and many religious people have no issue with selling wedding related items to homosexuals.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:43 PM
 
4,204 posts, read 4,453,256 times
Reputation: 10154
A foresee an off-off-off- Broadway musical based on this story..... (borrowing from an old tune) Sing along...


Gracie Fields: If I Knew You Were Coming I'd Have Baked A Cake -1950 - YouTube


If I knew you were coming I'd have baked a cake, baked a cake, baked a cake, If I knew you were coming...."

What I don't understand, is how in the h3ll the gay couple could not find another (GAY FRIENDLY) chef/bakery to bake them a wedding cake?

Its not like there is some huge barrier to entry for wedding cake makers, and why they would choose to give money to a business that they would most probably encourage their friends to boycott?

I surmise it is another 'pseudo event' likely staged for press coverage....
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:44 PM
 
14,917 posts, read 13,098,101 times
Reputation: 4828
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Jew View Post
I'll translate the Colorado Law into other words

No Religious Person is allowed to open a bakery thats sells wedding cakes, be a caterer of wedding, a wedding photographer etc.
Your translation is wrong. Plenty of religious people here in Colorado own/work in businesses that do those things.

Quote:
wouldn't you agree that who ever is in favor of that law is a bigot.
The bigot is the person who, when conducting commercial activity, refuses to sell a product/service to a buyer because he is gay or Jewish or black.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,202,347 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Jew View Post
let's says both of these gays considered themselves bisexual.


is it still discrimination based on sexual orientation.

remember it has nothing to do with their orientation because I would provide the cake to both of if they were really getting married to 2 other people.


In short discrimination has to be on a person not a event
Yes. Bisexual is a sexual orientation. The issue was making a cake for a GAY wedding. GAY is a sexual orientation.

I'm sorry that you don't agree with the law, but even religious people have to follow the law. If we made exceptions for religious beliefs, then no law would ever be able to be enforced.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:47 PM
 
14,917 posts, read 13,098,101 times
Reputation: 4828
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Jew View Post
In short discrimination has to be on a person not a event
That is true. That why anti-discrimination law address buyers, not what buyers intend to use the products for. The event or use is irrelevant.
 
Old 12-11-2013, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,202,347 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by ciceropolo View Post
A foresee an off-off-off- Broadway musical based on this story..... (borrowing from an old tune) Sing along...


Gracie Fields: If I Knew You Were Coming I'd Have Baked A Cake -1950 - YouTube


If I knew you were coming I'd have baked a cake, baked a cake, baked a cake, If I knew you were coming...."

What I don't understand, is how in the h3ll the gay couple could not find another (GAY FRIENDLY) chef/bakery to bake them a wedding cake?

Its not like there is some huge barrier to entry for wedding cake makers, and why they would choose to give money to a business that they would most probably encourage their friends to boycott?

I surmise it is another 'pseudo event' likely staged for press coverage....
The couple DID use another baker. The lawsuit is about the baker breaking the law of the state. The couple asked for no monetary compensation. The couple have done less media events than the baker.
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