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The mere fact that you have people dying on waiting lists is proof that the
Canadian healthcare system is under-funded.
Lol! I'll see your handful of people dying on waiting lists, and I'll raise you people dying in the USA because of not having insurance at all, or having treatment denied altogether.
Nearly 45,000 people die in the United States each year -- one every 12 minutes -- in large part because they lack health insurance and can not get good care, Harvard Medical School researchers found in an analysis released on Thursday http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/...58G6W520090917
Last edited by weltschmerz; 12-31-2013 at 04:10 PM..
Why don't you explain to us, how those pills came to be on this Earth.
I'll give you a hint: It wasn't Voodoo.
I'll give you another hint: It wasn't 1,000 monkeys sitting in a room with paper and crayons drawing out chemical formulas.
Nobody is pretending they did. It's coming to a head sooner or later. Drug companies can't afford to create these drugs for the few that can pay for them. Even without Obamacare health care costs are getting beyond those lucky enough to have coverage.
At some point to keep even those with coverage now in coverage someone is going to end up saying "no".
I was wondering when you'd show up, posting your walls of text, ranting once more about the same cardiac caths and your endless logorrhea about the horrors of Canadian healthcare, which you have never experienced up close and personal.
Did you mention Diane yet, or will that be in your next post?
Some folks on this forum are professionals.
As much money as that industry makes, they can afford to have as many on the payroll as they please.
Their goal is to confuse, obfuscate, and create doubt.
[quote=borregokid;32806372
What about the people without insurance what are they supposed to pay. I guess they are on their own without insurance and the gubbermint to negotiate the rates.[/QUOTE]
Obamacare is supposed to deal with those people without insurance.
Lol! I'll see your handful of people dying on waiting lists, and I'll raise you people dying in the USA because of not having insurance at all, or having treatment denied altogether.
If anyone doubts that story is valid, here is my thread I did in 2010 with photos of the bill breakdown for the same procedure but I was in and out in 1 day not 2. Hospital billed $30,000 but settled with $10,000 with my Aetna.
and once again, thats because billed rates have absolutely NOTHING to do with whats reinbursed. I've been saying that for years here and a bunch of left wing kooks continued to tell me I have no idea what I'm talking about..
Lol! I'll see your handful of people dying on waiting lists, and I'll raise you people dying in the USA because of not having insurance at all, or having treatment denied altogether.
and once again, thats because billed rates have absolutely NOTHING to do with whats reinbursed. I've been saying that for years here and a bunch of left wing kooks continued to tell me I have no idea what I'm talking about..
Don't know if you are refering to me as a left wing kook or just others but I never supported Obama care I slam it but I do think there is something wrong with the health care situation in America with its billing practices and cut offs for certain people who would supposedly cost too much.
So say the hospital charges you who may be paying without insurance $30,000 and you just say ok and pay it I think they'll just take the money even though they would take less from insurance. Why are they trying make a person pay $1000 for a room when they would accept $200 from insurance?
Maybe a single person paying out of pocket could negotiate but maybe not. For the average American who makes $15 to $25 a hour a $20,000 or $30,000 bill makes them in debt for a long time basically holding them back from ever getting ahead and that is just a common appendix operation. Paying off a medical bill say $100 a month would take a long long time and that is about how much a lot of people could afford to pay unless they dedicated their whole life to paying off a medical bill but that isn't much of a life then.
I am all for being responsible and paying your due but being beholden to the medical system is not a life to look forward to.
The hospitals are about the only industry I know that won't provide up front costs usually they can only give a guess and then later send you more bills for this and that, and a industry that knows you can't say no unless you want to suffer or die. Cut yourself with a chain saw and then call around for a estimate, while you bleed to death. It doesn't work that way.
Do you have the same concern for the guy who got his $11K bill for an appendicitis? I'd consider that pretty reasonable.
The fact that you dont have to worry about it is meaningless. If one lived in a communist country, they wouldnt need to worry about housing costs, but that doesnt mean we should all celebrate such a system..
This rhetoric is a huge part of the problem the US has with healthcare.
For a start, you're comparing an actual PAID amount of $11K with this poster's insured amount. He might have received $300,000 worth of treatment but insurance would have covered it all and his real PAID amount would have been $0.
You might compare this to a communist system, but I might also compare yours to a capitalist system that has gone out of control.
Can you tell me why here, in Australia, the CT scan my (American - on a bridging visa) wife had on her back cost $399 WITHOUT INSURANCE and yet the guy's itemised bill that started this whole thread listed his CT scan at $6983? The US is supposed to be a technological and medical powerhouse, isn't it? Note that the Australian $399 is not subsidised in any way - that's just what it costs.
A few weeks later we made a trip to the emergency room. Her back pain (which turned out to be a bulging disc) was radiating into her chest and we just wanted to be safe. Here's the sign that greeted us. The true horror of the costs of an uninsured emergency room visit emblazoned in a blood-curdling red.
So an uninsured emergency room visit -- even for people not eligible for Australia's national health care -- has a base cost of $203AUD - given that the AUD is currently buying about 87 US cents, it's really around $190 or so.
Fortunately, by this time, I had discovered that my wife was eligible for our Medicare even on her bridging visa and the eight hour stay, consults with various doctors, ultrasound, various medications and tests, cost us a grand total of $0. When I lived with the wife in Las Vegas for six years I had pretty good health; however, I did experience a frightening gall bladder attack once. They worked out what the problem was, gave me morphine, and kept me in hospital for two nights because my white blood cell count was up. Not long before I checked out, I was astounded to be visited by a "financial counselor" -- a concept unknown back home in Australia. Our bill came to about $50000 but thanks to our "excellent" insurance in the US I "only" had to pay $2500 or so. Then, a couple of years ago in Australia, I had another gall bladder attack. My stones are pretty quiet so I prefer to manage them with diet rather than have an operation, but this was awful and sustained. About halfway through the second day of excruciating pain I could bear it no longer and called my mother to have her drive me to hospital. I had the choice of a 2 minute drive to a private hospital or a 20 minute one to the nearest public hospital. Even uninsured I only paid $300 for emergency admission, morphine - etc.
I guess what I am saying is that this is not about whose health plan is better or whether Obamacare is good or bad (I think it's pretty pointless in tackling the real problem, to be honest), but is about why the current "well, they don;t want to die or be in extreme pain - let's milk them for all we can" system and how it needs to be fixed.
How can the same thing cost 20 times as much in the USA when compared to Australia? (remember, we're not even talking about insurance here - we're talking about base costs and charges).
The USA should be a light on the hill for other nations to aspire to - not some embarrassing disaster with inflated health costs which bear more similarity with the runaway inflation in Zimbabwe where a loaf of bread, in 2008, cost 16 million dollars. The Zimbabwean dollar and economy is a basket case. What's America's excuse?
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