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Old 03-27-2014, 08:41 AM
Status: "Summer!" (set 28 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,035 posts, read 102,723,474 times
Reputation: 33084

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Keegan View Post
As soon as you start tossing around the ridiculous hyperbole of capital punishment for minor theft, you lose all credibility in this conversation. But I'll play along for a bit.

I've managed retail stores. If you catch someone stealing once, chances are VERY HIGH they've stolen much more that you didn't catch. Once you catch them, you get rid of them, because it's not going to stop if you don't.

As to the notion that the firing wasn't really about the theft; so what? Maybe you're right. Perhaps it annoyed him that he couldn't put her on the schedule on a day that he needed her to work. But he didn't fire her for that, did he? Would I be surprised to learn that, since she was a difficult employee in some respects, he took the opportunity to fire her as soon as she screwed up on something else? No, I would not. Perhaps if she's been a model employee, easy to deal with, available to work as needed, perhaps he'd have reacted differently to this minor theft. But she wasn't. So she didn't. That's how life works, and I have absolutely no issue with that. Why would you?

And really? Are you actually advocating theft? Saying that it's ok, and that there shouldn't be punishment for such a minor theft? Since others do it in similar circumstances, that it's ok for this girl to do it? At what level would it be OK for the owner of this store to punish someone who steals from him? How much does he have to lose in small increments before it's an issue he's allowed to pursue? $5? $10?
An attitude like that is just a complete & total lack of respect for other people & what belongs to them.
I was using hyperbole. You know, like Rush Limbaugh vs Sandra Fluke?

I'm sure that most employees who have been caught stealing have stolen before. But to call this "stealing" as in stealing a drawer full of cash, or even a bag of coffee is a stretch. Funny how you don't like my hyperbole, but you engage in some of your own. Some stores actually have a pot of coffee and small cups for the shoppers.

No, the manager didn't fire her for making a request he didn't like; he simply found another reason. All of us have probably done something, at some point in time, perhaps inadvertently and perhaps not, that is against the personnel policies of our employer. It's easy enough to find something, reading email on work time, posting on CD on work time (for which a lot of people on here should probably be fired), etc.
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Old 03-27-2014, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Area 51.5
13,904 posts, read 11,497,866 times
Reputation: 9079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post

I'm sure that most employees who have been caught stealing have stolen before. But to call this "stealing" as in stealing a drawer full of cash, or even a bag of coffee is a stretch. Funny how you don't like my hyperbole, but you engage in some of your own. Some stores actually have a pot of coffee and small cups for the shoppers.
I'm curious. What, exactly, would you call it if not stealing?

And what on God's Green Earth does what other stores do have to do with this? Do you not realize when shops give away free stuff, the cost is built into other products?

Good God! It's seriously hopeless to expect people to be honest! Unfortunately, the 19 year old in the story just plain wasn't raised right. If she doesn't know better by age 19, she simply wasn't taught. There's a lot of that going around, it seems.
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Old 03-27-2014, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Martinsville, NJ
6,162 posts, read 11,256,870 times
Reputation: 3958
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I was using hyperbole. You know, like Rush Limbaugh vs Sandra Fluke?

I'm sure that most employees who have been caught stealing have stolen before. But to call this "stealing" as in stealing a drawer full of cash, or even a bag of coffee is a stretch. Funny how you don't like my hyperbole, but you engage in some of your own. Some stores actually have a pot of coffee and small cups for the shoppers.

No, the manager didn't fire her for making a request he didn't like; he simply found another reason. All of us have probably done something, at some point in time, perhaps inadvertently and perhaps not, that is against the personnel policies of our employer. It's easy enough to find something, reading email on work time, posting on CD on work time (for which a lot of people on here should probably be fired), etc.
To call this stealing is a stretch? A person took something that did not belong to her, without permission from the owner. That's not a stretch. In fact, it's the dictionary definition of "steal."
Quote:
take (another person's property) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it.
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Old 03-27-2014, 09:32 AM
Status: "Summer!" (set 28 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,035 posts, read 102,723,474 times
Reputation: 33084
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Cooper View Post
I'm curious. What, exactly, would you call it if not stealing?

And what on God's Green Earth does what other stores do have to do with this? Do you not realize when shops give away free stuff, the cost is built into other products?

Good God! It's seriously hopeless to expect people to be honest! Unfortunately, the 19 year old in the story just plain wasn't raised right. If she doesn't know better by age 19, she simply wasn't taught. There's a lot of that going around, it seems.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Keegan View Post
To call this stealing is a stretch? A person took something that did not belong to her, without permission from the owner. That's not a stretch. In fact, it's the dictionary definition of "steal."
So I suppose you two in your vast experience as business owners/managers, fired everyone who "stole" company pens, paper, used the company computer on work time, gave some token away to a customer for goodwill, e.g. you with the flower shop, you never gave a customer an extra flower just for good measure (stealing from yourself, but stealing nevertheless)? Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill! Make the girl pay up, tell her it is store policy not to do that.
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Old 03-27-2014, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn,NY
10,616 posts, read 13,172,387 times
Reputation: 16174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
So I suppose you two in your vast experience as business owners/managers, fired everyone who "stole" company pens, paper, used the company computer on work time, gave some token away to a customer for goodwill, e.g. you with the flower shop, you never gave a customer an extra flower just for good measure (stealing from yourself, but stealing nevertheless)? Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill! Make the girl pay up, tell her it is store policy not to do that.



This^

I would also like to ask how many here have found themselves out on a cold night with no place to go? Trust me, It's the scariest s**t you can ever deal with. She should not have lied about, But a $1 in the register and not violating the policy again would have sufficed.
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Old 03-27-2014, 10:05 AM
 
47,573 posts, read 60,701,947 times
Reputation: 22283
Quote:
Originally Posted by geofra View Post
I'll bring up the other theft here...

charging a dollar for a friggin' cup of coffee.


The owner can do what he wants, it's his store. However, firing the poor girl for giving away an overpriced cup of coffee is a complete over-reaction, and it makes me think that the guy had other problems with her. This was the straw that broke the camel's back.
The prices are raised to cover the costs of theft.
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Old 03-27-2014, 10:12 AM
 
6,409 posts, read 3,598,411 times
Reputation: 7355
Quote:
Originally Posted by D. Scott View Post
[/b]

This^

I would also like to ask how many here have found themselves out on a cold night with no place to go? Trust me, It's the scariest s**t you can ever deal with. She should not have lied about, But a $1 in the register and not violating the policy again would have sufficed.
My husband and I got stuck in Virginia during the blizzard driving up I-95 from Florida to NY a few years ago. Cars and trucks stuck on the highway in the snow. It took over an hour to make it to an exit to get off, in the middle of the night. Called to try to get a hotel for the night. All booked. Only place to go to spend the night until the roads were plowed was to pull into a gas station with a convenience store.

Every space was filled with cars doing the same as us. We went into the store to get a HOT cup of coffee and something to eat. They had a platter out of FREE donuts and rolls. No charge for coffee or hot chocolate. They said any car that was there could spend the night there. Tried to sleep in the car, but it was not only uncomfortable but very cold. We went in several times during the night for more hot coffee. All you want they said.

Did they have to do this? Absolutely not, but we remembered this and on our next trip up North we went back to that gas station to fill up and PAY to get some food.

Southern Hospitality? Ladysmith, Virginia. I will never forget the name of that place
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Old 03-27-2014, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Martinsville, NJ
6,162 posts, read 11,256,870 times
Reputation: 3958
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
So I suppose you two in your vast experience as business owners/managers, fired everyone who "stole" company pens, paper, used the company computer on work time, gave some token away to a customer for goodwill, e.g. you with the flower shop, you never gave a customer an extra flower just for good measure (stealing from yourself, but stealing nevertheless)? Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill! Make the girl pay up, tell her it is store policy not to do that.
It's not stealing if you are the owner and have the authority to make the decision to give away WHAT YOU OWN.

Anyone employee that needs to be told that theft is not part of the store policy is not worth having as an employee.
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Old 03-27-2014, 10:19 AM
 
10,340 posts, read 10,370,121 times
Reputation: 4014
I think it was the Christian thing to do because he was in distress. Just tell the clerk that any coffee give away comes from your check.
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Old 03-27-2014, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Texas
871 posts, read 693,085 times
Reputation: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
So I suppose you two in your vast experience as business owners/managers, fired everyone who "stole" company pens, paper, used the company computer on work time, gave some token away to a customer for goodwill, e.g. you with the flower shop, you never gave a customer an extra flower just for good measure (stealing from yourself, but stealing nevertheless)? Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill! Make the girl pay up, tell her it is store policy not to do that.
She not only stole, she LIED about. Yes, she needed to be terminated. I have done all of what you have mentioned, difference - I am the owner - I have the authority to do it. She already knew it was store policy to not give away merchandise for free....or she would not have lied about it.
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